If we get Cumbie...
- Thread starter JLHorns
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Can't see him leaving TCU. More cons than pros.
You're going to be working with two QBs who have shown they are not good college-level passers. So the chances you can turn this around is not good to start with. And if this experiment doesn't work, Strong's gone, and so are you.
If it works, you look like the greatest OC ever. But do you really want to leave a good/great gig for a lateral move that MAYBE might end up better than what you have?
Can't see a logical explanation to take it outside of money.
You're going to be working with two QBs who have shown they are not good college-level passers. So the chances you can turn this around is not good to start with. And if this experiment doesn't work, Strong's gone, and so are you.
If it works, you look like the greatest OC ever. But do you really want to leave a good/great gig for a lateral move that MAYBE might end up better than what you have?
Can't see a logical explanation to take it outside of money.
Three year guaranteed contract at a million plus per year. If you leave after year one, seems like you still pocket the 3 mil, and move on to the next gig. If you turn it around, you get a lot of credit and can step right into consideration for big time HC jobs.
Hook 'em
If I were Cumbie I would take this job. 2 years ago, Trevone Boykin didn't look much better than Swoopes and Heard. He can certainly make a difference in UT's offense. I think this would be a great hire for UT, and it's the perfect time for Cumbie to take a risk. Even if Strong gets fired next year, Cumbie will land an OC job somewhere else.
Its not lateral.
Becoming THE play caller is a big deal.
These CoOC things are in title and fun and all.....but the OC is the guy that calls the plays. Then there is just everyone else. And if he has aspirations to be an HC some day....he has to be have OC success somewhere first.
Not so sure about this. My biggest complaint is a lack of a guy that was an accurate passer in a passing offense in HS. Heard is the closest thing to that. No clue what we really have in Kai, but I do know that he ran a heavy running offense in HS. That worries me a lot. Great athlete. Good bloodlines. Smart kid. Not sure he can be an accurate passer and Strong doesn't have time to sit and watch for a few years for him to develop. Give Kai a shot, but maybe he is better suited as an athlete at other positions. Unless they can really groom him to pass the ball. Not saying they can't, but I'm not holding my breath for it.
I see it as Heard is the #1. Spend all summer teaching him how to pass. And tailoring an offense to utilize our strengths on O and his strengths. I don't think all is lost with him yet. He is still young and raw. But showed in HS that he can win and showed he can pass a bit too. And had flashes this year. I'd drill confidence in to Heard and fire up him and the whole damn team on consistency.
I love that Buechele is coming in early to compete. Try to get the true frosh rust off him as fast as you can, but I see him as more of a mid season option if others flounder. And the real future guy I have hope in to lead us to compete for CCs, etc. (and I'd put him in every classroom with Collin Johnson and force the two to build chemistry, and Burt can show them how to get to each building every day)
I'd move Swoopes to TE and still keep a rare 18wheeler package with him. Won't happen. He will still be our backup and probably start some games next year.
I'd pair Merrick with a grad xfer and have them compete to be the backup that allows Buechele to possibly RS or stay on the bench early in the year. Like say Towles from Kentucky. Big arm. Lots of experience. He'd be a so so backup in a pinch that could add experience to a QB video room that seriously could use it. (other possible grad xfers are the UGA QB who started one game but has Florida ties to Strong, the kid from Ole Miss Kincade who wants to come back closer to TX, and already 3 other guys I can't remember who announced they'd be early grad xfers at QB already that could provide a body and some deeper competition for us at a much needed position)
Strangely, I respectfully disagree.I don't know what we have in Kai, but I would love to see. However, I have begun to think that Swoopes has more potential than Heard. If he can't even grasp the simple concept of throwing the ball away instead of taking the sack I have worries. I believe if Kai doesn't pan out our best choice is Buschel.
I understand being optimistic, but Heard and Swoopes never turned into Bridgewater under Watson. I don't expect either to become Boykin under Cumbie. We need to look at Kai next year since he redshirted or even a freshman. It's time to move on from Heard and Swoopes.
Maybe Cumbie can talk Strong into a juco.....
Maybe Cumbie can talk Strong into a juco.....
I've heard that Kai is a film room junkie. That's what it's going to take to thrive in a new offense.
Heard reportedly doesn't spend the time in film room so I can see Kai passing him in a new offense. Redshirt Buechele and the QB situation starts to make some sense for the 1st time in a long time. Let the best one win the job.
It's fun to speculate, but lets get an OC and see what happens.
Heard reportedly doesn't spend the time in film room so I can see Kai passing him in a new offense. Redshirt Buechele and the QB situation starts to make some sense for the 1st time in a long time. Let the best one win the job.
It's fun to speculate, but lets get an OC and see what happens.
Swoopes has the most potential because you can't teach that big arm (between he and Heard) and until he got hurt a little against bailor played pretty good actually. I think the Buechele kid will be further along than some think after a spring and summer before fall camp.
Heard NEVER learning to get rid of the ball and taking huge sacks or run out of bounds sacking himself makes you want to pull your dang hair out.
Boykin the year before Meacham and Cumbie had a 122 passer rating. Heard has a 126 passer rating. At TT Cumbie started a walk-on over the scholarship QBs on the roster. That walk-on left when Cumbie left. You might be familiar with that walk-on ... Baker Mayfield.
Cumbie is a CO-OC that doesn't call the plays. He has to call plays before he can get a HC job. You repeat the improvement with TCU's offense at Texas, as the play caller, and you're a proven hot commodity for a major HC position. Harsin had to leave BSU to show that it wasn't all Petersen. Chizik and Muschamp had to leave Auburn and show it wasn't all Tuberville. Cumbie has to go show it isn't all Meacham.
An 11-1 Texas, with a loss to another 11-1 team, would have been in the playoffs last year.
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Right now Swoopes is better than Heard. Swoopes has embraced his 18 wheeler persona and has become the more effective runner, imo. Both still couldn't hit water if they fell out of a boat though.
Right now Robinson is potential, he is not a good QB right now. Would I be excited if we got him? Of course he can red shirt and become a great player if he devleops given his potential. Ehlinger however seems as college ready as a high school junior can be. I don´t know if I would risk losing Sam.
The one thing Watson got right was getting Buechelle and Ehlinger, Texas cannot afford another project, another Swoopes or Heard type of player who may or may not pan out. I would rather take a guy with a lower ceiling but a high floor. Good thing about these two kids is that as high as their floor is, their ceiling is not low at all.
The one thing Watson got right was getting Buechelle and Ehlinger, Texas cannot afford another project, another Swoopes or Heard type of player who may or may not pan out. I would rather take a guy with a lower ceiling but a high floor. Good thing about these two kids is that as high as their floor is, their ceiling is not low at all.
The problem with Swoopes is that he never had any real coaching in HS. He was just developmentally so far behind when he got here, and I'm not sure there is anyone who could have made up all that ground coaching him. Trying to put him in an overcomplicated offense with a bunch of five-step drops certainly wasn't the way to start out, though.
I think Heard actually has the most potential of the two, given his prior success in a passing offense, but his piss-poor work ethic is just a killer. Does he not realize that even VY had to turn into a film-room (and practice-field) junkie before he became truly dominant? And VY was a hell of a lot better than Heard is even before he started devouring film, so what on earth makes Heard think he can just coast by on talent? So frustrating. And can anyone actually see Heard rallying guys to the practice field every day in the summertime for 7-on-7 and 11-on-11 work? Remember "If you want to beat Ohio State, meet me here every night at 6:30"?
I didn't realize Heard was in a passing offense in school....I thought it was run heavy. My mistake. I would have loved to have had Swoopes RS and be taught by a great QB coach though. I think you are right about Heards work ethic. At some point a player (especially QB) has to say "give me the ball"......I thought the last 4 or 5 games Heard regressed or something.
saw this on hsr and not sure how valid it is . TCU poster said that the Paterson/cumbia meeting is over.
Word is Perrin promised Cumbie that Strong would get a 4th year as long as they went to a bowl next year. Perrin felt like he had to make that commitment or Strong wouldn't be able to bring in any top notch OC.
It looks like the metric for Strong to get a 4th year has been established. It seems the bar may be a little lower for Strong next year than some of the big money boys may have wanted. Supposedly, Perrin got the support from the people he needed to make that commitment to Cumbie.
Word is Perrin promised Cumbie that Strong would get a 4th year as long as they went to a bowl next year. Perrin felt like he had to make that commitment or Strong wouldn't be able to bring in any top notch OC.
It looks like the metric for Strong to get a 4th year has been established. It seems the bar may be a little lower for Strong next year than some of the big money boys may have wanted. Supposedly, Perrin got the support from the people he needed to make that commitment to Cumbie.
No idea if anything we're hearing is valid, but that makes sense. I know some people wouldn't be happy with it, but it would be a move that improves our chances of taking big step forward next year (and beyond). It will be a challenge to get top-notch assistant coaches and recruiters in here otherwise.
That seems expected. I wish the bar were higher a little higher, and not that it can't change, but that seems low. I don't like putting a win total on it because being competitive in all our games is a big step forward even if the record doesn't reflect it.
That being said my expectations are low.
That being said my expectations are low.
I agree. Sometimes wins or losses do not tell the whole story. How you play and are you getting better beginning to end of the season are important too.
This.
Swoopes looks the part. And has some raw physical tools. But it was those tools and a single wing run offense that he ran vs low competition in HS.......and he didn't exactly lead his team to wins.
Meanwhile, Heard has some physical tools but passed the ball in HS along with running it and he lead his team to championships in high HS competition.
And while I am not a huge fan of dog and pony shows or tshirt competitions.......Heard looked good and drew praise in Elite 11 camps from scouts and former NFL QBs and coaches. For his ability to run, read D's, and some solid accuracy. Swoopes meanwhile was heavily questioned in these same camps in those areas. Fast forward to Buechele and guys like Dilfer are the highest on him out of the 3. Clearly the most polished passer of the group and he has some wiggle to him too.
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All valid points, Longyac. But to me it's still more cons than pros.
There's more chance that he won't be as successful than there is that he will be. That's just my humble opinion. If he were to be successful, as you and I pointed out, it's a huge feather in his cap.
But if he's not successful, Strong's gone, and he's back to looking for a position job. If being at Texas can be a great springboard if you're successful, then surely the opposite is just as true. If you can't be successful at Texas, with all its resources, then it can hurt you. His resume is strong enough currently that he can afford to wait for a better opening.
In all honesty, if he didn't have such a great name and resume, I'd think he'd jump at the chance. But then again a place like Texas wouldn't be looking at him if he didn't.
Lots to think over, and I'm sure he weighed all this before turning down Texas.
