Many of us consider 2015 Strong's first year to remake the roster due to how the transition was handled.
Official Signing Day Thread.......
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Many of us consider 2015 Strong's first year to remake the roster due to how the transition was handled.
Ok so Mack had more than I thought, but Strong is on a break neck pace. The point remains that it's great to be excited about recruiting, but skepticism is still warranted
It's year two of the biggest rebuilding job we've ever seen. He's rebuilding the talent even in the toughest of times. The players obviously believe in him, and that's a big part of the battle. It was gonna get worse before it could get better. Give the man time to do his job.
This.
Lots of coaches take over programs in much worse shape, and they don't consecutively do worse on the field than the last coach. The Mack Brown excuse only goes so far. As does the no talent excuse.
FACTS
Macks team went 8-5 in his last year. With no real major losses from that roster to the NFL.
Charlie took that team and went 6-7. Then magically with a roster devoid of talent...somehow the NFL didn't notice and it drafted 5 players (3 of which were voted rookies of the yr by their respective teammates)....and at least 3 more players were signed to practice squads and saw snaps in games.
Charlie then goes 5-7. And there will be guys drafted. Of which many of you here will blame Mack and credit Charlie.
Lets not be Aggie. Constantly blaming the last guy for the current guys losses. Charlie had work to do. Just like every coach that takes over when a previous coach leaves. So far it hasn't been that impressive. What he is doing well, is he is doing it his way. He finally let go of the issues on the offensive coaching staff that he never should have brought with him. And I do firmly believe it is headed in the right direction. But plenty of coaches have had winning records with far, far less.
One of the things I respect most about him, is that he points out at the end of each year that HIS staff was the one coaching the players and HIS staff needs to do better. I am so glad we don't see him blaming Mack. You know, since Mack hasn't been on a sideline since two rivals website redesigns ago.
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Recruiting rankings are cute and all. And I love the foundation that Strong is building. But those recruits need to translate in to wins.
Lots of people here got fed up with Mack winning recruiting titles and then winning 10 or 12 games and too often missing out on winning the conference. Mack got fired when the norm became 9 wins or so.
I'd love too see Strong win 9 games. Hell I'd take a winning season from him. I really believe he is building it. And yeah, I'm excited about recruiting. But only because that tends to translate to wins. It is nut cutting time aka time to translate things to some wins. Mack Brown didn't make Strong hire Watson. Mack didn't make him keep him to revamp the O in to a style he knew nothing about. And Mack didn't demote him one game in to year 2. Mack Brown didn't count on Ash to be a starter, only to not get a backup plan more ready. And Mack Brown didn't boot off a bunch of the OL. And Mack didn't tell Strong he couldn't address the QB situation before year 3 or not take a transfer QB. Just saying. Mack isn't on the sidelines anymore. Only time I talk about Mack, is when I see his commentary on my TV.
Yeah the draft pics that played really well were on the defensive side of the ball. Lets look at the offense. We lost two starters on the O-line one of which would have been an NFL draft pick. Espinosa with a broken foot, Estelle who couldn't stop somking pot. And then there was Mason Walters, Trey Hopkins, and Donald Hawkins who were all done in 2013. So you have 5 new starters on the O-line and depth was so bad they had to bring a Defensive Tackle over. Then lets talk about QB. In 2013 we hand noodle arm and slow Case McCoy but he had a football IQ that was light years ahead of Swoopes.
So in 2014 we go to a QB who by all accounts never should have been recruited as a QB playing behind and O-Line with 5 new starters and no real depth. Do you really think Mack would have done better with that group?
How good would Texas have been in 1998 if Richard Walton wouldn't have gotten hurt? Mack lucked into Major. Chris Simms would've started as a true freshman in '99 and there wouldn't have been any Major Applewhite.
What the hell are you talking about? When did I ever say I forgot about Mack's suckage?
For all of Mack's issues, he had a few skins on the wall, and none of them had anything to do with recruiting. With that said, he used up all of them by 2013. I was calling for his head long before the ax fell. No one was happier when we finally pushed him out.
Well, for those few skins on the wall, Mack was allowed to stay too long and sink the ship. It's gonna take time to come back from that. Take your meds and calm down. It will get better. Strong is doing a hell of a job building the new foundation. Give it time. Rome wasn't built in a day.
You never heard a peep out of me in year 1, but last year was proof enough we were in pretty bad shape on offense and Strong had no answer for the offensive side.
Biggest rebuilding Job??? Hyperbole much.
You obviously weren't around in 84. People complain about not getting guys from the national top 100 list, back then we couldn't pull guys from the Texas top 100 list. Texas was known as a racist school.
We live in a time of instant gratification. We want it in everything. Building a program takes time. It will take time to get good players and I believe we are on our way. Next year will be better but be reasonable, you don't go 5-7 and then win 10 games the next. We will be better but there could be set backs. Everyone stay away from the cliff!
Ah, and the triumph of the signing day thread has devolved into the sunshine pumpers vs the pessimistic doom-and-gloom types. And suddenly it's way less interesting.
I'm in between. I think that we're progressing a bit slower than my more optimistic side thought, but I also realize that even good teams end up having a bad loss here or there so making "he better not ever lose to [team x] again!!" type proclamations are a little ridiculous.
I'm at a point where I feel there has to be clear improvement in the 2016 team, but that it's going to take a few different metrics to decide whether that happened, and that I'm hopeful and reasonably optimistic that the changes that have been made in the coaching staff, the maturation of younger players and the new recruits should lead to improvement. To be clear, that's both optimism AND expectation on my part. And, I mean, if those expectations aren't met, there will be plenty of time at that point to say "ok, yeah, this isn't working".
Until then, Coach Strong has done things to help improve the team. I'm going to look at it as a possibility that some of those things work. It's a lot more fun than wallowing in the pessimism of it not working. If it ends up being a decent season, I'd love for Coach Strong to have the chance to lead the team with last year's freshmen as juniors and this recruiting class as sophomores. That's what I'm hoping for. But if it ends up being a bad season... the internet will still be here for me to voice my disappointment when it actually happens.
I'm in between. I think that we're progressing a bit slower than my more optimistic side thought, but I also realize that even good teams end up having a bad loss here or there so making "he better not ever lose to [team x] again!!" type proclamations are a little ridiculous.
I'm at a point where I feel there has to be clear improvement in the 2016 team, but that it's going to take a few different metrics to decide whether that happened, and that I'm hopeful and reasonably optimistic that the changes that have been made in the coaching staff, the maturation of younger players and the new recruits should lead to improvement. To be clear, that's both optimism AND expectation on my part. And, I mean, if those expectations aren't met, there will be plenty of time at that point to say "ok, yeah, this isn't working".
Until then, Coach Strong has done things to help improve the team. I'm going to look at it as a possibility that some of those things work. It's a lot more fun than wallowing in the pessimism of it not working. If it ends up being a decent season, I'd love for Coach Strong to have the chance to lead the team with last year's freshmen as juniors and this recruiting class as sophomores. That's what I'm hoping for. But if it ends up being a bad season... the internet will still be here for me to voice my disappointment when it actually happens.
Agreed. Its time to show on the field. No more blowouts to weak competition. No showing up to beat a top 10 team one week and disappearing the next. Only to play a great half the next and then not show up in the following week.
Gotta compete week in and out. No youth excuses. No blaming Mack. We have more talent than the ISUs of the world. No getting shut out by teams like them. No missing bowls. No blowouts in a bowl. No losing seasons. No regressing.
Gotta compete week in and out. No youth excuses. No blaming Mack. We have more talent than the ISUs of the world. No getting shut out by teams like them. No missing bowls. No blowouts in a bowl. No losing seasons. No regressing.
I believe we can think Texas should have played better than it has over the last 2 years with Strong and still think Strong can get it done. I don't think anybody is saying we should have been undefeated. Like jsto says a post up.. no more playing your butt off against ou and not showing up the next game out......no more blaming Mack, The year before Mack arrived those same players that everyone is patting on the back got crushed week after week......I still have nightmares about ucla and route 66.....the next year a different coach turned that team around and got the talent out of them that they did not show the PREVIOUS YEAR...
when a team is not ready to play shows up they will look worse than they are
Strong hired Watson......not Mack
Strong kept Watson.......not Mack
Strong hired Koenig...not Mack
Strong hired Chambers...not mack
Strong hired Wickline who I think is terribly overrated..not Mack
Strong said when he first arrived (I have already proven this once) he would have a fast-paced wide open offense that would spread it out. Not what we got. NOW he has FINALLY went to a Big 12 offense that can work if run properly.
I am holding Strong accountable just like he holds himself and his players accountable.
Strong is on the right track now both in recruiting and in offensive philosophy. I don't think it is too late for Strong to knock it out of the park. I don't know anybody that wants him to fail that is a Longhorn fan. I will NEVER go against my Longhorns.
The people going by Strongs recruiting rankings are the same ones saying Macks high recruiting rankings (from the same damn sites) were wrong and there is no talent at Texas...which is it? Can we go by recruiting rankings or not?
when a team is not ready to play shows up they will look worse than they are
Strong hired Watson......not Mack
Strong kept Watson.......not Mack
Strong hired Koenig...not Mack
Strong hired Chambers...not mack
Strong hired Wickline who I think is terribly overrated..not Mack
Strong said when he first arrived (I have already proven this once) he would have a fast-paced wide open offense that would spread it out. Not what we got. NOW he has FINALLY went to a Big 12 offense that can work if run properly.
I am holding Strong accountable just like he holds himself and his players accountable.
Strong is on the right track now both in recruiting and in offensive philosophy. I don't think it is too late for Strong to knock it out of the park. I don't know anybody that wants him to fail that is a Longhorn fan. I will NEVER go against my Longhorns.
The people going by Strongs recruiting rankings are the same ones saying Macks high recruiting rankings (from the same damn sites) were wrong and there is no talent at Texas...which is it? Can we go by recruiting rankings or not?
They had a bunch starters out the 4-8 year, either suspended or injured, that returned the following year.
it had nothing to do with bringing in a new Offense and Offensive Coordinator? Playing to the players strengths? It was just....some players returned?
I disagree. I think they got the right coaches and they got the MOST out of their players.
Mack hire Chambers and Strong kept him on. Strong figured out Chambers was deadweight in year one. Chambers was on Mack's staff for 16 years.
Wickline is pretty widely considered one of the top 5 college OL coaches in the nation but he's prickly SOB. Patterson's BS made that an unfixable relationship with The University. We had 2 freshmen American OL last year and a hell of a run game for a team with zero passing threat.
Strong's classes addressed most of the areas of need and they did not get the Mack/Texas bump from being committed to Texas. Mack's highly ranked classes included no DTs one year. Project QBs. Maxed out suburban football factory kids. etc. And most of that without elevating their Senior season. Look at Sumlin's class this year. No DTs, no immediate impact OLs which is a desperate need, 1 LB that didn't even have an offer from in state Tenn. No big back to take on SEC MLBs. It is a top 20 ranked class but failed at addressing their actual needs.
I'd ready like to see a component of the class recruiting ranking that relates to if the team's needs were addressed.
So in breaking it all down. Strong has not made a single error.
Wickline is WIDELY described as one of the top 5 OL coaches? I would say that is highly questionable. Afterall the OL coach is responsible for teaching AND recruiting. If Wickline were top 5 he would not be at West Virginia somebody would have snatched him up in a heartbeat.
You are blaming Mack for Strong HIRING Chambers? Really? I think you have your mind dead set that Strong does no wrong and all problems go back to Mack.
So Mack's classes were over-rated because he got a bump from the sites? Why would the sites give Mack a bump and no one else? There is no question Mack left a team without a lot of talent.......but it was more talent than some of you make it out to be. Those players were OFFERED BY EVERYONE FOR A REASON.
Texas has more talent than Iowa st. And even if it is close on that front.......Texas was NOT READY TO PLAY. Was Iowa St. 24-0 better than Texas? Texas outplayed ou and they SHOWED UP and played HARD...that is the Texas team that needs to show up every week. I could have stomached the loss to Iowa St. (not easily) if Texas at least showed up and gave effort......watch the game...Texas thought they were going to ride in there and blow Iowa St. off the field with no problem.....their minds were not right.....it was not about talent.
Playing hard will make up for talent in a lot of ways. I watched MOJO beat teams they had no business being on the field with because they played smart and they played hard.
Coach Strong is a good coach and a good man. I truly hope he gets Texas going......I think he can. But he has made some mistakes. He admits them all the time but some of his supporters think he has been perfect.
Here is the bottom line......Has Coach Strong gotten the MOST out of this team the 2 years he has been here? Every game? I mean no other coach could have gotten more? If you say he has then that is cool but I disagree big time.
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Yes...Tcu got new coaches which made a big difference, but the main reason they went 4-8 the year before was they were decimated by injuries....injured players who returned the next year.....Their improvement was NOT just new schemes and coaches.I DO expect better results from our new offensive schemes, not miracles, but better results.I expect better results from more experience in our young players.
I am probably the only guy that does not think Ridgeway will a huge loss like Brown was the year before. My reasoning is that he was hurt for much of the year and was not at 100% anyway. I wish we had him, but next man up!.....I expect us to win 8 games and while I hope for 9 I dream of 10.....dreams dont usually come true, but I have hope I have not had for 6 years...(for you young guys, 6 years is a long time)
swVA...you have pointed out the fatal flaw in Mack....The players that he got that were very highly recruited WERE good players. They just never developed the way they should have. Jeffcoat and Hicks were very high 5 star guys and not one ounce over rated.They should have been pushing for AA honors, but languished as second string on all conference teams. ...yeah, yeah, they were both injured a lot.I think that can go back to improper conditioning. James was a 5* OL....never amounted to crap. I agree that Strong made bad hires, but I think you over estimate the talent level that Strong inherited....oh yeah....I left out that too many starters were druggies and academic cripples.
I want this Texas team to play like their hair is on fire. I want the offense to resemble a FBS offense. I want this team to show up every week and not just ou and baylor. I want the excuses as to why they can't win or can't compete to stop. This team will not be a playoff team and we all know that.......just show up and play as hard as you can. No one can ask for more than that.
One more thing.....get better week to week, improve as the season goes along and not stay the same or get worse.
Don't get me wrong Oldhorn......I know the talent level was down. but that talent level showed up against ou......why couldn't it show up at Iowa St.? That is my point. It isn't JUST talent. It goes to my other point. Did Strong get the MOST out of his Texas teams for the 2 years he has been here? Could not have had them play any better? could not have had a better offensive philosophy? game management?
And by better I don't mean necessarily a better record........No one on here as ever seen me post we should have been undefeated.
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I never said it was JUST the OC change. I said do you think that may have helped? I think it did. Do you think if TCU kept the exact same everything on the team that went 4-7 that they would have went 12-1 the next year ONLY because hurt players were back? I don't.
I have said all along bringing Watson back for '15 was a mistake.
I'm going just by coaching and no other part of the job.
Just pointing out Mack had the guy for 16 years and people are bitching about 1 year with Strong. Again this one goes in the how the transition to a new staff was handled IMO.
Rival's writers now openly call it the Bama bump. Bobby Burton was taken to task over KendallJones ranking when he got destroyed in the All Star game. Burton's defense? He's going to Bama and Saban knows how to use guys like him. If these services were that good at elevating talent they'd be on a staff. They are mostly going by what teams are interested in the kid.
Then you should be a fan of rankings by offers.
http://www.rankbyoffers.com/2016fbteams/
Strong is definitely learning on the job and needs an OC that takes care of that side of the ball for him. But there is still a lot of things that are the Mack and the administrations fault that people are trying to put on Strong.
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