Biden fear mongering Covid hoax No. 2

[HornVol]

Chris Cuomo Makes Ivermectin About-Face After Denouncing Its Use for COVID: ‘I Am Now Taking a Regular Dose’

"Joe Rogan was right," says the former anchor for CNN, where he once said its proponents "need to be called out and shamed" The post Chris Cuomo Makes Ivermectin About-Face After Denouncing Its Use for COVID: ‘I Am Now Taking a Regular Dose’ appeared first on TheWrap.

www.yahoo.com

soon there will be 1 lone stooge left that thinks Ivermectin doesn't work , but like so many other Liberal stooges, their self arrogance remains the problem

 

[clob94]

soon there will be 1 lone stooge left that thinks Ivermectin doesn't work , but like so many other Liberal stooges, their self arrogance remains the problem

Will you do me a favor?

Will you go find @danhorn and @1consummate1 and some of those other anal bead using cvnt muffins and tell them to come on down here and take their ass whippings like men?

They spent 9 months or more harassing us and calling us names only to now vanish (like the fvcking little yellow bellied stink nuggets that they are) and now won't even return our phine calls.

What gives? They still kicking it around up there in $9.95 land? Pretending nothing ever happened. Like nothing was ever said? Like they don't deserve to stick the biggest piece of "I told you so" cock right down their throats?

Please- copy this post. Shame them with it. Goad them to come down here and be a man. They deserve every fvcking ounce of ridicule they having coming to them.

 

[HornVol]

Will you do me a favor?

Will you go find @danhorn and @1consummate1 and some of those other anal bead using cvnt muffins and tell them to come on down here and take their ass whippings like men?

They spent 9 months or more harassing us and calling us names only to now vanish (like the fvcking little yellow bellied stink nuggets that they are) and now won't even return our phine calls.

What gives? They still kicking it around up there in $9.95 land? Pretending nothing ever happened. Like nothing was ever said? Like they don't deserve to stick the biggest piece of "I told you so" cock right down their throats?

Please- copy this post. Shame them with it. Goad them to come down here and be a man. They deserve every fvcking ounce of ridicule they having coming to them.

don't forget @FWHORN


these Liberals are just not normal people

there was a Doctor on the site that chastised me for stating what my group of Doctors had said early on about IVERMECTIN and HTDRXCHL

what type of man does that and then never apologizes

i just cant imagine their life and their mental state ....to be wrong so often and so consistently and then just vanish like a mongrel.... then, as if nothing was ever said, pick up and start the process over again DCI is another one


#mentalillness

 

[clob94]

don't forget @FWHORN


these Liberals are just not normal people

there was a Doctor on the site that chastised me for stating what my group of Doctors had said early on about IVERMECTIN and HTDRXCHL

what type of man does that and then never apologizes

i just cant imagine their life and their mental state ....to be wrong so often and so consistently and then just vanish like a mongrel.... then, as if nothing was ever said, pick up and start the process over again DCI is another one


#mentalillness

It blows me away that these poonwagons think that I'm going to forget the absolute torrent of shitpostings, name calling, and overall fvcktardery that they displayed for 18 months in the face of obvious facts. Fvck I'd fight every one of them if they had the balls to accept. I'll never let these assholes forget. Ever.

Nobody should.

 

[hookem777]

It blows me away that these poonwagons think that I'm going to forget the absolute torrent of shitpostings, name calling, and overall fvcktardery that they displayed for 18 months in the face of obvious facts. Fvck I'd fight every one of them if they had the balls to accept. I'll never let these assholes forget. Ever.

Nobody should.

but but but orange man is racist and Lord Fauci said we were helping keep people safe! AT LEAST WE CARE!!!!

STOP HURTING MY FEELINGS WITH YOUR CONSERVITIVE FACTS!!!!

 

[MATF]

Chris Cuomo Makes Ivermectin About-Face After Denouncing Its Use for COVID: ‘I Am Now Taking a Regular Dose’

"Joe Rogan was right," says the former anchor for CNN, where he once said its proponents "need to be called out and shamed" The post Chris Cuomo Makes Ivermectin About-Face After Denouncing Its Use for COVID: ‘I Am Now Taking a Regular Dose’ appeared first on TheWrap.

www.yahoo.com

Not surprising. Cuomo has turned into a full-blown nutcase since his fall from grace.

 

[hornyheart]

So, I’m not saying you are wrong or Cuomo, and I’m admittedly left leaning- not hard left but educated and believe in a blend of capitalism and a social conscience. But the research on how effective it was against COVID-19 is still in doubt. This is from National Institute of Health (yes I do believe that government while it can be highly inefficient has a big and mostly positive role in our society) last updated in 12/23:

Ivermectin​

Last Updated: December 20, 2023

Ivermectin is a Food and Drug Administration (FDA)-approved antiparasitic drug used to treat several neglected tropical diseases, including onchocerciasis, helminthiases, and scabies.1 For these indications, ivermectin has been widely used and is generally well tolerated.1,2 Ivermectin is not approved by the FDA for the treatment of any viral infection, including COVID-19.
Ivermectin has been shown to inhibit the replication of SARS-CoV-2 in cell cultures.3 However, pharmacokinetic and pharmacodynamic studies suggest that achieving the plasma concentrations necessary for the antiviral efficacy detected in vitro would require administration of doses up to 100-fold higher than those approved for use in humans.4,5
The safety and efficacy of ivermectin for the prevention and treatment of COVID-19 have been evaluated in clinical trials and observational cohorts. Summaries of the studies that informed the COVID-19 Treatment Guidelines Panel’s (the Panel) recommendation can be found in Table 7b. The Panel reviewed additional studies, but these studies are not summarized in Table 7b because they have study design limitations or results that make them less definitive and informative.

Recommendation​

• The Panel recommends against the use of ivermectin for the treatment of COVID-19 ().

Rationale​

The Panel’s recommendation is primarily informed by adequately powered, randomized trials of ivermectin that reported clinical outcomes. Studies that randomized participants to receive ivermectin or a matched placebo had the greatest impact on the Panel’s recommendation.6-13
Trials have failed to find a clinical benefit of using ivermectin to treat COVID-19 in outpatients. In TOGETHER, an adaptive platform trial conducted in Brazil, there was no apparent difference between the ivermectin and placebo arms for the primary outcome of risk of emergency department visits or hospitalization (14.7% vs. 16.4%).14 In addition, there was no statistically significant difference between the ivermectin and placebo arms in mortality (3.1% vs. 3.5%). In COVID-OUT, a randomized factorial trial, the use of ivermectin did not reduce the occurrence of a composite outcome of emergency department visits, hospitalization, or death when compared with a matched control (5.7% vs. 4.1%).6
The ACTIV-6 trial was an adaptive platform trial conducted in outpatients with mild to moderate COVID-19 in the United States.15,16 Participants were randomized to receive an ivermectin regimen (either 400 μg/kg for 3 days or 600 μg/kg for 6 days) or a matching placebo. In the 400 μg/kg phase of the study, the median time to sustained recovery was 12 days for the ivermectin arm and 13 days for the placebo arm. In the 600 μg/kg phase of the study, the median time to sustained recovery was 11 days for both arms.
I-TECH, an open-label trial conducted in Malaysia, found no difference between the ivermectin and standard of care arms in the occurrence of the primary outcome of risk of progression to severe COVID-19 (21.6% vs. 17.3%).17 Patients in the ivermectin arm had a lower risk of mortality than those in the standard of care arm (relative risk 0.31; 95% CI, 0.09–1.11; P = 0.09), but this difference was not statistically significant.
The study populations in most of the reviewed trials were patients with mild to moderate COVID-19 who had a relatively low risk of disease progression, and the number of deaths was low (as expected). In these randomized trials, completely excluding an effect of ivermectin on COVID-19 disease progression is difficult because the trials were not powered to detect differences in secondary outcomes, such as death. However, data from these trials do not provide evidence that the use of ivermectin is effective for the treatment of COVID-19. For this reason, and because other medications now have demonstrated clear clinical benefits for the treatment of COVID-19, the Panel recommends against the use of ivermectin for the treatment of COVID-19 ().
See Table 7b for summaries of key studies that informed the Panel’s recommendation.

Now if your saying Big Pharma influenced these studies … well I’m not going to say your wrong but this was the information we were working from at the time…and they didn’t recommend ingesting disinfectant or shining a light inside your body. Just sayin’…Fire away. 😊🤘🏼

 

[outhereincali]

So, I’m not saying you are wrong or Cuomo, and I’m admittedly left leaning- not hard left but educated and believe in a blend of capitalism and a social conscience. But the research on how effective it was against COVID-19 is still in doubt. This is from National Institute of Health (yes I do believe that government while it can be highly inefficient has a big and mostly positive role in our society) last updated in 12/23:

Ivermectin​

Last Updated: December 20, 2023

Ivermectin is a Food and Drug Administration (FDA)-approved antiparasitic drug used to treat several neglected tropical diseases, including onchocerciasis, helminthiases, and scabies.1 For these indications, ivermectin has been widely used and is generally well tolerated.1,2 Ivermectin is not approved by the FDA for the treatment of any viral infection, including COVID-19.
Ivermectin has been shown to inhibit the replication of SARS-CoV-2 in cell cultures.3 However, pharmacokinetic and pharmacodynamic studies suggest that achieving the plasma concentrations necessary for the antiviral efficacy detected in vitro would require administration of doses up to 100-fold higher than those approved for use in humans.4,5
The safety and efficacy of ivermectin for the prevention and treatment of COVID-19 have been evaluated in clinical trials and observational cohorts. Summaries of the studies that informed the COVID-19 Treatment Guidelines Panel’s (the Panel) recommendation can be found in Table 7b. The Panel reviewed additional studies, but these studies are not summarized in Table 7b because they have study design limitations or results that make them less definitive and informative.

Recommendation​

• The Panel recommends against the use of ivermectin for the treatment of COVID-19 ().

Rationale​

The Panel’s recommendation is primarily informed by adequately powered, randomized trials of ivermectin that reported clinical outcomes. Studies that randomized participants to receive ivermectin or a matched placebo had the greatest impact on the Panel’s recommendation.6-13
Trials have failed to find a clinical benefit of using ivermectin to treat COVID-19 in outpatients. In TOGETHER, an adaptive platform trial conducted in Brazil, there was no apparent difference between the ivermectin and placebo arms for the primary outcome of risk of emergency department visits or hospitalization (14.7% vs. 16.4%).14 In addition, there was no statistically significant difference between the ivermectin and placebo arms in mortality (3.1% vs. 3.5%). In COVID-OUT, a randomized factorial trial, the use of ivermectin did not reduce the occurrence of a composite outcome of emergency department visits, hospitalization, or death when compared with a matched control (5.7% vs. 4.1%).6
The ACTIV-6 trial was an adaptive platform trial conducted in outpatients with mild to moderate COVID-19 in the United States.15,16 Participants were randomized to receive an ivermectin regimen (either 400 μg/kg for 3 days or 600 μg/kg for 6 days) or a matching placebo. In the 400 μg/kg phase of the study, the median time to sustained recovery was 12 days for the ivermectin arm and 13 days for the placebo arm. In the 600 μg/kg phase of the study, the median time to sustained recovery was 11 days for both arms.
I-TECH, an open-label trial conducted in Malaysia, found no difference between the ivermectin and standard of care arms in the occurrence of the primary outcome of risk of progression to severe COVID-19 (21.6% vs. 17.3%).17 Patients in the ivermectin arm had a lower risk of mortality than those in the standard of care arm (relative risk 0.31; 95% CI, 0.09–1.11; P = 0.09), but this difference was not statistically significant.
The study populations in most of the reviewed trials were patients with mild to moderate COVID-19 who had a relatively low risk of disease progression, and the number of deaths was low (as expected). In these randomized trials, completely excluding an effect of ivermectin on COVID-19 disease progression is difficult because the trials were not powered to detect differences in secondary outcomes, such as death. However, data from these trials do not provide evidence that the use of ivermectin is effective for the treatment of COVID-19. For this reason, and because other medications now have demonstrated clear clinical benefits for the treatment of COVID-19, the Panel recommends against the use of ivermectin for the treatment of COVID-19 ().
See Table 7b for summaries of key studies that informed the Panel’s recommendation.

Now if your saying Big Pharma influenced these studies … well I’m not going to say your wrong but this was the information we were working from at the time…and they didn’t recommend ingesting disinfectant or shining a light inside your body. Just sayin’…Fire away. 😊🤘🏼

Fwiw the first one in DC who advocated for ivermectin was an aggie (Louis Gohmert). Draw your own conclusion.

 

[Etlonghorn]

don't forget @FWHORN


these Liberals are just not normal people

there was a Doctor on the site that chastised me for stating what my group of Doctors had said early on about IVERMECTIN and HTDRXCHL

what type of man does that and then never apologizes

i just cant imagine their life and their mental state ....to be wrong so often and so consistently and then just vanish like a mongrel.... then, as if nothing was ever said, pick up and start the process over again DCI is another one


#mentalillness

Was that the x-Ray tech guy that pretended to be a DR? He was a real winner.

 

[Etlonghorn]

So, I’m not saying you are wrong or Cuomo, and I’m admittedly left leaning- not hard left but educated and believe in a blend of capitalism and a social conscience. But the research on how effective it was against COVID-19 is still in doubt. This is from National Institute of Health (yes I do believe that government while it can be highly inefficient has a big and mostly positive role in our society) last updated in 12/23:

Ivermectin​

Last Updated: December 20, 2023

Ivermectin is a Food and Drug Administration (FDA)-approved antiparasitic drug used to treat several neglected tropical diseases, including onchocerciasis, helminthiases, and scabies.1 For these indications, ivermectin has been widely used and is generally well tolerated.1,2 Ivermectin is not approved by the FDA for the treatment of any viral infection, including COVID-19.
Ivermectin has been shown to inhibit the replication of SARS-CoV-2 in cell cultures.3 However, pharmacokinetic and pharmacodynamic studies suggest that achieving the plasma concentrations necessary for the antiviral efficacy detected in vitro would require administration of doses up to 100-fold higher than those approved for use in humans.4,5
The safety and efficacy of ivermectin for the prevention and treatment of COVID-19 have been evaluated in clinical trials and observational cohorts. Summaries of the studies that informed the COVID-19 Treatment Guidelines Panel’s (the Panel) recommendation can be found in Table 7b. The Panel reviewed additional studies, but these studies are not summarized in Table 7b because they have study design limitations or results that make them less definitive and informative.

Recommendation​

• The Panel recommends against the use of ivermectin for the treatment of COVID-19 ().

Rationale​

The Panel’s recommendation is primarily informed by adequately powered, randomized trials of ivermectin that reported clinical outcomes. Studies that randomized participants to receive ivermectin or a matched placebo had the greatest impact on the Panel’s recommendation.6-13
Trials have failed to find a clinical benefit of using ivermectin to treat COVID-19 in outpatients. In TOGETHER, an adaptive platform trial conducted in Brazil, there was no apparent difference between the ivermectin and placebo arms for the primary outcome of risk of emergency department visits or hospitalization (14.7% vs. 16.4%).14 In addition, there was no statistically significant difference between the ivermectin and placebo arms in mortality (3.1% vs. 3.5%). In COVID-OUT, a randomized factorial trial, the use of ivermectin did not reduce the occurrence of a composite outcome of emergency department visits, hospitalization, or death when compared with a matched control (5.7% vs. 4.1%).6
The ACTIV-6 trial was an adaptive platform trial conducted in outpatients with mild to moderate COVID-19 in the United States.15,16 Participants were randomized to receive an ivermectin regimen (either 400 μg/kg for 3 days or 600 μg/kg for 6 days) or a matching placebo. In the 400 μg/kg phase of the study, the median time to sustained recovery was 12 days for the ivermectin arm and 13 days for the placebo arm. In the 600 μg/kg phase of the study, the median time to sustained recovery was 11 days for both arms.
I-TECH, an open-label trial conducted in Malaysia, found no difference between the ivermectin and standard of care arms in the occurrence of the primary outcome of risk of progression to severe COVID-19 (21.6% vs. 17.3%).17 Patients in the ivermectin arm had a lower risk of mortality than those in the standard of care arm (relative risk 0.31; 95% CI, 0.09–1.11; P = 0.09), but this difference was not statistically significant.
The study populations in most of the reviewed trials were patients with mild to moderate COVID-19 who had a relatively low risk of disease progression, and the number of deaths was low (as expected). In these randomized trials, completely excluding an effect of ivermectin on COVID-19 disease progression is difficult because the trials were not powered to detect differences in secondary outcomes, such as death. However, data from these trials do not provide evidence that the use of ivermectin is effective for the treatment of COVID-19. For this reason, and because other medications now have demonstrated clear clinical benefits for the treatment of COVID-19, the Panel recommends against the use of ivermectin for the treatment of COVID-19 ().
See Table 7b for summaries of key studies that informed the Panel’s recommendation.

Now if your saying Big Pharma influenced these studies … well I’m not going to say your wrong but this was the information we were working from at the time…and they didn’t recommend ingesting disinfectant or shining a light inside your body. Just sayin’…Fire away. 😊🤘🏼

I’m not going to blast you. You had the balls to come down to the Dungeon and own where you stand politically and I don’t recall you being one of the pack of vermin that lectured us daily about what pathetic excuses for humans we were. Honestly I think a lot of guys down here probably agree with your take on 90% of the world. I will however ask the following question.
How much trust should we have in their recommendation about Ivermectin when this group is part of the same bunch of slap nuts that told us dust masks will stop a virus, the Covid virus couldn’t go more than 5’11” to spread to someone else, their shot is better than natural immunity, and the whole came from a bunch of guys cooking up bat soup at the local meat market?

 

[hornyheart]

Great points. I think that information mutated along with the virus. The virus early on didn’t spread as much as we thought but was deadlier to those that were immune-compromised than the later versions of the virus that spread faster but less fatal.

Masks were some defense but K1N1 were necessary to really be an effective barrier- unfortunately we didn’t have what we needed to protect most of the masses.

The shots prevented many, many more deaths but the combination of natural immunity and vaccines ultimately ended the risk to most (although ANY vaccine will have negative effects on a small percentage of mass populations).

Wet markets are horrible but ultimately a politically expedient scapegoat because all governments are playing around with bad shit and no one wants to a point finger lest their four others get exposed pointing back at them.

I don’t trust the government, I hate the bureaucracy, believe we waste too much, know that the tax laws are written by rich people who don’t want to be taxed and believe that the elimination of government won’t solve what we need to solve to be the great country that I love.

3 things that won’t happen that will solve many of our problems:

1. All national and state elections are publicly funded. The ultimate campaign finance reform.

2. Term limits on all congressional seats. 4 terms for the house 3 terms for the senate.

3. If we don’t have a balanced budget - every member of congress gets fired and we start over.

 

[clob94]

Great points. I think that information mutated along with the virus. The virus early on didn’t spread as much as we thought but was deadlier to those that were immune-compromised than the later versions of the virus that spread faster but less fatal.

Masks were some defense but K1N1 were necessary to really be an effective barrier- unfortunately we didn’t have what we needed to protect most of the masses.

The shots prevented many, many more deaths but the combination of natural immunity and vaccines ultimately ended the risk to most (although ANY vaccine will have negative effects on a small percentage of mass populations).

Wet markets are horrible but ultimately a politically expedient scapegoat because all governments are playing around with bad shit and no one wants to a point finger lest their four others get exposed pointing back at them.

I don’t trust the government, I hate the bureaucracy, believe we waste too much, know that the tax laws are written by rich people who don’t want to be taxed and believe that the elimination of government won’t solve what we need to solve to be the great country that I love.

3 things that won’t happen that will solve many of our problems:

1. All national and state elections are publicly funded. The ultimate campaign finance reform.

2. Term limits on all congressional seats. 4 terms for the house 3 terms for the senate.

3. If we don’t have a balanced budget - every member of congress gets fired and we start over.

1. The virus did change- so did the info. However, there were an elite group claiming they had all the answers- every time. Instead of saying "hey guys, this is the best we can do right now"- they said "you can't spread it, it's not airborne" then "Well you can spread it, but it's not airborne". Then "if you get the Vax you won't get it". Then "if you get the Vax and GET it, it DIES in you and you won't spread it". Then "if you get the Vax and catch it, you can spread it BUT it won't kill you".
It was a bunch of bullsh!t from start to finish.
Early on (and you can research it here) this group figured out that the old, sick, fat, and weak, were those at most risk. We laid it out.
We laid out that "not just any mask would work".
We laid out that, unlike EVERY OTHER disease, where folks have similar symptoms, this one was different. Everyone was having different symptoms. Well by golly, that doesn't happen in nature. If you get the flu you get THESE symptoms. Everyone does.

If you get chicken pox you get THESE symptoms..... Everyone does.

If you get Malaria-- you get THESE symptoms.... etc. In fact, that's how 99% of illnesses are diagnosed by Doctors-- by looking at the symptoms.

But not covid- if hit people differently.

The first round of covid (you said it was the worst)---- hell I had it-- didn't even KNOW I had it. Got tested because a family members got sick and they told me I'd had it. I didn't even know.
.the second round, I had a runny nose for a day.
The 3rd round, I got SICK. Like, on the couch woth 102 fever sick for 4 days.

The last round, I sneezed for 2 days. No fever, some runny nose stuff- and it was over.
And here was sat, a group of dudes made up of Doctors, engineers, teachers, military personnel, law enforcement, etc-- and as we discussed what we were seeing in the world daily, we were attacked by dudes that were simply towing a political line out of (mostly) fear and ignorance-- but moreso a rebuff of a cult of personality that was dominating the political landscape at the time.

I don't give a shit what horse de-wormer worked or didn't work- what I care about is the fact that people tried to take away the freedom of choice of their fellow man. It reminds me of the books I've read about WWII and how Jews shamed other Jews onto trains that led them to their demise. I lost a family member a few weeks ago that was the LAST person I'll probably ever know that ACTUALLY lived a brief portion of her life under Nazi control. Before she lost her mental faculties, she told me that this whole "covid reaction by the powers that be" reminded her of the rise of the Reichstag.
And before you discount that opinion, remember- she lived through BOTH of these occurrences. (Cool story about how she used to man the Cathedral tower lookout in Strasbourg as a pre-teen).

We shut the world down at the behest of people that assured us of "certainties".
Many of these people deserve a bullet.

2. 4 terms in the house, 2 in the Senate.

3. If we don't have a balanced budget, we start shooting.

Go back and read the Declaration. There's a few sentences in there that say "Hey guys, when your government starts usurping you and acting like controlling assholes, your have a DUTY and a RIGHT to THROW THEM OFF".
I ask you-- what does "throw them off" mean, in 1776?

Does it mean "vote them out".

Nope.

It means exactly like it sounds.

 

[Oldmanastro]

1. The virus did change- so did the info. However, there were an elite group claiming they had all the answers- every time. Instead of saying "hey guys, this is the best we can do right now"- they said "you can't spread it, it's not airborne" then "Well you can spread it, but it's not airborne". Then "if you get the Vax you won't get it". Then "if you get the Vax and GET it, it DIES in you and you won't spread it". Then "if you get the Vax and catch it, you can spread it BUT it won't kill you".
It was a bunch of bullsh!t from start to finish.
Early on (and you can research it here) this group figured out that the old, sick, fat, and weak, were those at most risk. We laid it out.
We laid out that "not just any mask would work".
We laid out that, unlike EVERY OTHER disease, where folks have similar symptoms, this one was different. Everyone was having different symptoms. Well by golly, that doesn't happen in nature. If you get the flu you get THESE symptoms. Everyone does.

If you get chicken pox you get THESE symptoms..... Everyone does.

If you get Malaria-- you get THESE symptoms.... etc. In fact, that's how 99% of illnesses are diagnosed by Doctors-- by looking at the symptoms.

But not covid- if hit people differently.

The first round of covid (you said it was the worst)---- hell I had it-- didn't even KNOW I had it. Got tested because a family members got sick and they told me I'd had it. I didn't even know.
.the second round, I had a runny nose for a day.
The 3rd round, I got SICK. Like, on the couch woth 102 fever sick for 4 days.

The last round, I sneezed for 2 days. No fever, some runny nose stuff- and it was over.
And here was sat, a group of dudes made up of Doctors, engineers, teachers, military personnel, law enforcement, etc-- and as we discussed what we were seeing in the world daily, we were attacked by dudes that were simply towing a political line out of (mostly) fear and ignorance-- but moreso a rebuff of a cult of personality that was dominating the political landscape at the time.

I don't give a shit what horse de-wormer worked or didn't work- what I care about is the fact that people tried to take away the freedom of choice of their fellow man. It reminds me of the books I've read about WWII and how Jews shamed other Jews onto trains that led them to their demise. I lost a family member a few weeks ago that was the LAST person I'll probably ever know that ACTUALLY lived a brief portion of her life under Nazi control. Before she lost her mental faculties, she told me that this whole "covid reaction by the powers that be" reminded her of the rise of the Reichstag.
And before you discount that opinion, remember- she lived through BOTH of these occurrences. (Cool story about how she used to man the Cathedral tower lookout in Strasbourg as a pre-teen).

We shut the world down at the behest of people that assured us of "certainties".
Many of these people deserve a bullet.

2. 4 terms in the house, 2 in the Senate.

3. If we don't have a balanced budget, we start shooting.

Go back and read the Declaration. There's a few sentences in there that say "Hey guys, when your government starts usurping you and acting like controlling assholes, your have a DUTY and a RIGHT to THROW THEM OFF".
I ask you-- what does "throw them off" mean, in 1776?

Does it mean "vote them out".

Nope.

It means exactly like it sounds.

Early morning baby feeding? I’ve got a swim meet in an hour.

 

[hornyheart]

1. The virus did change- so did the info. However, there were an elite group claiming they had all the answers- every time. Instead of saying "hey guys, this is the best we can do right now"- they said "you can't spread it, it's not airborne" then "Well you can spread it, but it's not airborne". Then "if you get the Vax you won't get it". Then "if you get the Vax and GET it, it DIES in you and you won't spread it". Then "if you get the Vax and catch it, you can spread it BUT it won't kill you".
It was a bunch of bullsh!t from start to finish.
Early on (and you can research it here) this group figured out that the old, sick, fat, and weak, were those at most risk. We laid it out.
We laid out that "not just any mask would work".
We laid out that, unlike EVERY OTHER disease, where folks have similar symptoms, this one was different. Everyone was having different symptoms. Well by golly, that doesn't happen in nature. If you get the flu you get THESE symptoms. Everyone does.

If you get chicken pox you get THESE symptoms..... Everyone does.

If you get Malaria-- you get THESE symptoms.... etc. In fact, that's how 99% of illnesses are diagnosed by Doctors-- by looking at the symptoms.

But not covid- if hit people differently.

The first round of covid (you said it was the worst)---- hell I had it-- didn't even KNOW I had it. Got tested because a family members got sick and they told me I'd had it. I didn't even know.
.the second round, I had a runny nose for a day.
The 3rd round, I got SICK. Like, on the couch woth 102 fever sick for 4 days.

The last round, I sneezed for 2 days. No fever, some runny nose stuff- and it was over.
And here was sat, a group of dudes made up of Doctors, engineers, teachers, military personnel, law enforcement, etc-- and as we discussed what we were seeing in the world daily, we were attacked by dudes that were simply towing a political line out of (mostly) fear and ignorance-- but moreso a rebuff of a cult of personality that was dominating the political landscape at the time.

I don't give a shit what horse de-wormer worked or didn't work- what I care about is the fact that people tried to take away the freedom of choice of their fellow man. It reminds me of the books I've read about WWII and how Jews shamed other Jews onto trains that led them to their demise. I lost a family member a few weeks ago that was the LAST person I'll probably ever know that ACTUALLY lived a brief portion of her life under Nazi control. Before she lost her mental faculties, she told me that this whole "covid reaction by the powers that be" reminded her of the rise of the Reichstag.
And before you discount that opinion, remember- she lived through BOTH of these occurrences. (Cool story about how she used to man the Cathedral tower lookout in Strasbourg as a pre-teen).

We shut the world down at the behest of people that assured us of "certainties".
Many of these people deserve a bullet.

2. 4 terms in the house, 2 in the Senate.

3. If we don't have a balanced budget, we start shooting.

Go back and read the Declaration. There's a few sentences in there that say "Hey guys, when your government starts usurping you and acting like controlling assholes, your have a DUTY and a RIGHT to THROW THEM OFF".
I ask you-- what does "throw them off" mean, in 1776?

Does it mean "vote them out".

Nope.

It means exactly like it sounds.

Ok, I totally understand many of your points. But this wasn’t a US disease, it was a worldwide pandemic. My cousin was one of the first to get ill in NYC-hit him like a ton of bricks but he was young (although a type 1 diabetic) and relatively healthy (he doesn’t drink or smoke) and survived it. So many died a very horrible death though and not just those that were very old and unhealthy.

What was troubling is that the government had prepared for something like this but because it was an election year there was a denial that it was deadly or even that anything other than a normal flu was happening and we didn’t execute a plan of containment.

That being said, we have to understand we have personal freedoms but not at cost of collective freedoms. We have laws that ban driving a car without seatbelts being worn. Why? Because we analyzed the science and found that damage that was being done by not wearing seatbelts was hurting us collectively- we had hospitals full of head injured vegetables who needed full-time care that we collectively had to pay for for the rest of their lives.

For Covid-yes you got it and were fine and I’m sure you chose not to wear a mask and were pissed that society was asking that of you. But did you think about who you could have passed it to that then they passed it to their grandparents who got sick and died before their time?

No, cloth masked didn’t provide much protection but medical marks did (not 100% but decent protection) and by the time we caught up there wasn’t the supply needed to protect us.

The world shut down not just us, because we didn’t know and the best scientists of the world were (mostly) all saying the same thing as they were working to understand a once in a century pandemic that was mutating.

Personal freedoms should balance with societal freedoms in my opinion and that balance is sometimes very hard to find - especially in the midst of a crisis.

Comparing it to the Nazis who were committing genocide because of a bigoted ideology is a pretty harsh world view and definitely not how I see it but that is why this country is still great (but always flawed) we can have these debates without fear of one of us winding up in the gulag.

 

[HornVol]

Was that the x-Ray tech guy that pretended to be a DR? He was a real winner.

there always seems to be a story behind Democrats and Liberals ( i am assuming he is)
just like the Democratic Party itself, they don't have logic or honesty as pillars of their foundation

its why you see repeatedly what you describe....big, unsupportable statements , a lot of misdirection and striation when asked to support their statements and then fly away to the next thread

its a scumbag move and i cant envision the type of human that lives with that disparity and never reconciles


but that's evidently where we are as a society

 

[TX1972]

1. The virus did change- so did the info. However, there were an elite group claiming they had all the answers- every time. Instead of saying "hey guys, this is the best we can do right now"- they said "you can't spread it, it's not airborne" then "Well you can spread it, but it's not airborne". Then "if you get the Vax you won't get it". Then "if you get the Vax and GET it, it DIES in you and you won't spread it". Then "if you get the Vax and catch it, you can spread it BUT it won't kill you".
It was a bunch of bullsh!t from start to finish.
Early on (and you can research it here) this group figured out that the old, sick, fat, and weak, were those at most risk. We laid it out.
We laid out that "not just any mask would work".
We laid out that, unlike EVERY OTHER disease, where folks have similar symptoms, this one was different. Everyone was having different symptoms. Well by golly, that doesn't happen in nature. If you get the flu you get THESE symptoms. Everyone does.

If you get chicken pox you get THESE symptoms..... Everyone does.

If you get Malaria-- you get THESE symptoms.... etc. In fact, that's how 99% of illnesses are diagnosed by Doctors-- by looking at the symptoms.

But not covid- if hit people differently.

The first round of covid (you said it was the worst)---- hell I had it-- didn't even KNOW I had it. Got tested because a family members got sick and they told me I'd had it. I didn't even know.
.the second round, I had a runny nose for a day.
The 3rd round, I got SICK. Like, on the couch woth 102 fever sick for 4 days.

The last round, I sneezed for 2 days. No fever, some runny nose stuff- and it was over.
And here was sat, a group of dudes made up of Doctors, engineers, teachers, military personnel, law enforcement, etc-- and as we discussed what we were seeing in the world daily, we were attacked by dudes that were simply towing a political line out of (mostly) fear and ignorance-- but moreso a rebuff of a cult of personality that was dominating the political landscape at the time.

I don't give a shit what horse de-wormer worked or didn't work- what I care about is the fact that people tried to take away the freedom of choice of their fellow man. It reminds me of the books I've read about WWII and how Jews shamed other Jews onto trains that led them to their demise. I lost a family member a few weeks ago that was the LAST person I'll probably ever know that ACTUALLY lived a brief portion of her life under Nazi control. Before she lost her mental faculties, she told me that this whole "covid reaction by the powers that be" reminded her of the rise of the Reichstag.
And before you discount that opinion, remember- she lived through BOTH of these occurrences. (Cool story about how she used to man the Cathedral tower lookout in Strasbourg as a pre-teen).

We shut the world down at the behest of people that assured us of "certainties".
Many of these people deserve a bullet.

2. 4 terms in the house, 2 in the Senate.

3. If we don't have a balanced budget, we start shooting.

Go back and read the Declaration. There's a few sentences in there that say "Hey guys, when your government starts usurping you and acting like controlling assholes, your have a DUTY and a RIGHT to THROW THEM OFF".
I ask you-- what does "throw them off" mean, in 1776?

Does it mean "vote them out".

Nope.

It means exactly like it sounds

Those "experts" created the COVID virus...with OUR money. Without the NIH and Fauci the dark prince, there would have been no pandemic.

 

[HornVol]

Those "experts" created the COVID virus...with OUR money. Without the NIH and Fauci the dark prince, there would have been no pandemic.

try getting any of the party of science to debate the Covid debacle ( on any of the numerous fronts available )


these people are scum

• quick to parrot the Washington bureaucrats
• quick to condemn those that were skeptical ( to include keeping them out of traveling /grocery stores/schools /life)
• bought and repeated the hysteria over Ivermectin/Hydroxychloroquine, ridiculed those of us that had tried it and never did basic search on the drug ( Noble Prize winner for human consumption and river blindness...now almost 450 independent reports confirming efficacy ) rather bought their media "hose paste" label
• never said a word as "flu" patients were brought into old folks centers and incubated
• applauded the gov't who outlawed drugs that were shown to have significant impact against the disease
• lied about health effects of jab
• lied about massive negative effects of jab
• never apologized or acknowledged

the last item illustrates the modern day Liberals callous disregard for morals

they think they are smarter and morally superior ( though they struggle to support it in debate)
therefore their actions ( all their actions) are ok because they were trying to do and be for the right things


that is mental illness and the very definition of delusional

 

[clob94]

Ok, I totally understand many of your points. But this wasn’t a US disease, it was a worldwide pandemic. My cousin was one of the first to get ill in NYC-hit him like a ton of bricks but he was young (although a type 1 diabetic) and relatively healthy (he doesn’t drink or smoke) and survived it. So many died a very horrible death though and not just those that were very old and unhealthy.

What was troubling is that the government had prepared for something like this but because it was an election year there was a denial that it was deadly or even that anything other than a normal flu was happening and we didn’t execute a plan of containment.

That being said, we have to understand we have personal freedoms but not at cost of collective freedoms. We have laws that ban driving a car without seatbelts being worn. Why? Because we analyzed the science and found that damage that was being done by not wearing seatbelts was hurting us collectively- we had hospitals full of head injured vegetables who needed full-time care that we collectively had to pay for for the rest of their lives.

For Covid-yes you got it and were fine and I’m sure you chose not to wear a mask and were pissed that society was asking that of you. But did you think about who you could have passed it to that then they passed it to their grandparents who got sick and died before their time?

No, cloth masked didn’t provide much protection but medical marks did (not 100% but decent protection) and by the time we caught up there wasn’t the supply needed to protect us.

The world shut down not just us, because we didn’t know and the best scientists of the world were (mostly) all saying the same thing as they were working to understand a once in a century pandemic that was mutating.

Personal freedoms should balance with societal freedoms in my opinion and that balance is sometimes very hard to find - especially in the midst of a crisis.

Comparing it to the Nazis who were committing genocide because of a bigoted ideology is a pretty harsh world view and definitely not how I see it but that is why this country is still great (but always flawed) we can have these debates without fear of one of us winding up in the gulag.

Personal freedoms vs societal freedoms is great- but this wasn't about P vs S freedoms- it was about control. I see that as clear as day.
Look, I get the whole "don't wear a mask, get someone sick and gam-gam dies". I just don't buy into it.

Why?

Simple.

Covid was dangerous for those over 60, and those in poor health OR with a health defect like your Type 1 diabetes buddy.
The overwhelming majority of deaths from covid were folks that fell into those categories. Surely you can agree that healthy young people dying FROM covid (not with) were outliers.
Because they were.

Children didn't die from covid. I mean, maybe 1 or 2-- but healthy children simply didn't die of covid.
So why, as we were SCREAMING for at the time, not do this----
Quarantine the weak, and the young, healthy, and strong will keep the world spinning.
Don't want gam-gam to die? Put her in the back bedroom. Don't go around her. You've got pulmonary problems? Stay home. Get your food delivered. You're orca fat worh diabetes, stay home. Work from home. The rest of us will pick up the slack until this passes.

But that's not what was done. In fact, it was almost the opposite. By forcing masks on people it made the weak and sick feel like it was OK to go out into public. Like this mask would protect them (it really didn't).

And it wasn't that the experts were wrong-- ppl are wrong all the time. It was that they tried to be SO convincing that they were RIGHT, when common sense told you "hey, these fvcking guys claiming to be experts are full of sh!t. This sh!t being sold by the media is total propaganda."
Yet they did it with such bravado and confidence (selling their lies) that they convinced half the population that their bullsh!t was real.
It was a guess. And why not simply say "folks, we aren't sure, this is our best guess".....?

You know why.

Control.

 

[TX1972]

Personal freedoms vs societal freedoms is great- but this wasn't about P vs S freedoms- it was about control. I see that as clear as day.
Look, I get the whole "don't wear a mask, get someone sick and gam-gam dies". I just don't buy into it.

Why?

Simple.

Covid was dangerous for those over 60, and those in poor health OR with a health defect like your Type 1 diabetes buddy.
The overwhelming majority of deaths from covid were folks that fell into those categories. Surely you can agree that healthy young people dying FROM covid (not with) were outliers.
Because they were.

Children didn't die from covid. I mean, maybe 1 or 2-- but healthy children simply didn't die of covid.
So why, as we were SCREAMING for at the time, not do this----
Quarantine the weak, and the young, healthy, and strong will keep the world spinning.
Don't want gam-gam to die? Put her in the back bedroom. Don't go around her. You've got pulmonary problems? Stay home. Get your food delivered. You're orca fat worh diabetes, stay home. Work from home. The rest of us will pick up the slack until this passes.

But that's not what was done. In fact, it was almost the opposite. By forcing masks on people it made the weak and sick feel like it was OK to go out into public. Like this mask would protect them (it really didn't).

And it wasn't that the experts were wrong-- ppl are wrong all the time. It was that they tried to be SO convincing that they were RIGHT, when common sense told you "hey, these fvcking guys claiming to be experts are full of sh!t. This sh!t being sold by the media is total propaganda."
Yet they did it with such bravado and confidence (selling their lies) that they convinced half the population that their bullsh!t was real.
It was a guess. And why not simply say "folks, we aren't sure, this is our best guess".....?

You know why.

Control.

While I'm at it, after COVID escaped from the Wuhan lab, it started evolving towards more infectivity and less mortality. More evidence that it was lab created. When syphilis came to Europe from the western hemisphere, it often killed people in weeks to months. The early AIDS patients died quickly, now it's a chronic disease.

 

[hornyheart]

I’m socially liberal - meaning I try not to judge what people do in their personal lives and I’m fiscally more conservative. I believe that we should balance a budget by increasing revenue and decreasing expenses.

I try not to call people names and try to understand before being understood.

Dr Fauci worked for 7 different administrations both Republican and Democrat. He served this country and you may not agree with his real time analysis- that was a world view not just a US view - but it seemed to me he was working for a population's safety more so than an individual’s freedom which was his job.

Basic research was done on drugs and were found at the time with the strains of COVID that were being tested to not be as effectual as other drugs - was that the influence of Big Pharma - perhaps - but if you research who they back politically with their money it is very much BOTH sides of the aisle. If you research who got rid of campaign finance reform…both sides with the help of a right leaning Supreme Court.

We are the most medically advanced country on earth (broadly speaking) but we had a death rate from Covid that resembled the 3rd world.

I don’t hate the other side or believe everything I hear, see, or read from one source. I do believe in facts and I also believe that “alternative facts” were introduced by the Trump campaign to explain some inconvenient truths about their 2016 victory.

I hate where we are as a country because unless we lower the temperature and start governing from the middle our future will be challenging.

Signed

The pinko, liberal, scum of the earth.
(Really I’m just center left which used to be ok)

 

[TX1972]

I’m socially liberal - meaning I try not to judge what people do in their personal lives and I’m fiscally more conservative. I believe that we should balance a budget by increasing revenue and decreasing expenses.

I try not to call people names and try to understand before being understood.

Dr Fauci worked for 7 different administrations both Republican and Democrat. He served this country and you may not agree with his real time analysis- that was a world view not just a US view - but it seemed to me he was working for a population's safety more so than an individual’s freedom which was his job.

Basic research was done on drugs and were found at the time with the strains of COVID that were being tested to not be as effectual as other drugs - was that the influence of Big Pharma - perhaps - but if you research who they back politically with their money it is very much BOTH sides of the aisle. If you research who got rid of campaign finance reform…both sides with the help of a right leaning Supreme Court.

We are the most medically advanced country on earth (broadly speaking) but we had a death rate from Covid that resembled the 3rd world.

I don’t hate the other side or believe everything I hear, see, or read from one source. I do believe in facts and I also believe that “alternative facts” were introduced by the Trump campaign to explain some inconvenient truths about their 2016 victory.

I hate where we are as a country because unless we lower the temperature and start governing from the middle our future will be challenging.

Signed

The pinko, liberal, scum of the earth.
(Really I’m just center left which used to be ok)

I'm socially libertarian. I believe that people should do as they please as long as they don't harm others. Dr. Fauci is a bureaucrat who longed to "save" the world. That's why he insisted on backing "gain of function" research to CREATE a pathogen and then a vaccine. He wasn't allowed to do it here (thank you Barack Obama). Unfortunately $600,000. to the Wuhan Lab of Virology was enough to do it in China. Dr. Fauci's ex boss was Robert Gallo. Gallo's refusal to acknowledge the Pasteur Institute's isolation of HIV delayed the introduction of a blood test. Which caused many hemophiliacs from contaminated Factor 9. Bureaucrats often long for glory.

 

[HornVol]

I'm socially libertarian. I believe that people should do as they please as long as they don't harm others. Dr. Fauci is a bureaucrat who longed to "save" the world. That's why he insisted on backing "gain of function" research to CREATE a pathogen and then a vaccine. He wasn't allowed to do it here (thank you Barack Obama). Unfortunately $600,000. to the Wuhan Lab of Virology was enough to do it in China. Dr. Fauci's ex boss was Robert Gallo. Gallo's refusal to acknowledge the Pasteur Institute's isolation of HIV delayed the introduction of a blood test. Which caused many hemophiliacs from contaminated Factor 9. Bureaucrats often long for glory.

I'm a Libertarian Nationalist. I believe you should be able to do whatever you want as long as you don't make me pay for it ( in any way) or mess with children or harm others.. I believe the United States of America is easily the greatest country in the world made possible not by government, but because the limited aspect to self governance.
I believe "the right" wants to be left alone and live their lives and raise their family in this wonderful country. I believe the left cant allow that to happen and is pushing its thoroughly tested and failed theories onto the rest of us for now 50 years.
I believe the balance of power has tilted far to long to providing a permanent political and administrative state that taxes too much and attempts to involve itself into far too many areas , with disastrous results that it creates and never fixes . I believe our elected leaders long ago stopped representing the citizenry and have become beholden to the administrative state, crony capitalists and big money institutions . I believe the solution for us to return to the golden days is to provide states the most autonomy in running their day to day business and de-emphasize the central state.
I hold both parties to blame but both parties ignore the current situation in their own way rendering the election process futile.

I encourage the opportunity to provide at least 1 state pure autonomy to showcase what freedom, education, family, taxation , commerce and stability can be without the corrupt yoke of one size fits all government (COMPETITION)

 

[clob94]

I'm a Libertarian Nationalist. I believe you should be able to do whatever you want as long as you don't make me pay for it ( in any way) or mess with children or harm others.. I believe the United States of America is easily the greatest country in the world made possible not by government, but because the limited aspect to self governance.
I believe "the right" wants to be left alone and live their lives and raise their family in this wonderful country. I believe the left cant allow that to happen and is pushing its thoroughly tested and failed theories onto the rest of us for now 50 years.
I believe the balance of power has tilted far to long to providing a permanent political and administrative state that taxes too much and attempts to involve itself into far too many areas , with disastrous results that it creates and never fixes . I believe our elected leaders long ago stopped representing the citizenry and have become beholden to the administrative state, crony capitalists and big money institutions . I believe the solution for us to return to the golden days is to provide states the most autonomy in running their day to day business and de-emphasize the central state.
I hold both parties to blame but both parties ignore the current situation in their own way rendering the election process futile.

I encourage the opportunity to provide at least 1 state pure autonomy to showcase what freedom, education, family, taxation , commerce and stability can be without the corrupt yoke of one size fits all government (COMPETITION)

1 state should do it. Texas.

TEXIT now and let's be a small government, fiscally conservative, leave me alone and I'll leave you alone, state.

A guy can dream.

 

[Etlonghorn]

1 state should do it. Texas.

TEXIT now and let's be a small government, fiscally conservative, leave me alone and I'll leave you alone, state.

A guy can dream.

It will happen. Probably sooner than we think. To paraphrase Alexander Tytler, Democracy can only last until the masses realize they can vote themselves entitlements and F$&K everyone else.
We’re there for the most part. I believe we’re a lot closer to the inevitable breakup with the crazy bitch than anybody thinks.

 

[TX1972]

It will happen. Probably sooner than we think. To paraphrase Alexander Tytler, Democracy can only last until the masses realize they can vote themselves entitlements and F$&K everyone else.
We’re there for the most part. I believe we’re a lot closer to the inevitable breakup with the crazy bitch than anybody thinks.

Alexis de Toqueville.

 

[hornyheart]

Freedom is subjective and always a compromise.

One person's "Freedom" to not wear seatbelts for example, then imposes on another's Freedom - to be free of the expense of caring for the disability that comes with that decision...or perhaps we should just let all the poor bastards that wind up with head injuries die in the streets - good riddance - unless of course it is your mom, or your sister, or you.

Why should my rights as an adult human be trampled on because of someone else's religious beliefs - yet if I were to impregnate my wife (even though protection was used) that fetus' rights some how trump mine and my wife's rights in this state - what business is it of the State to tell me how or when I should procreate and how I should make decisions with my doctor and my partner?

Why can't my non-binary, transgender, gay child be allowed to choose their identity without bigotry, bias, or the state creating laws to decide that their healthcare choice is somehow "endangering" them, when it is in fact the exact opposite - this is a position supported by most doctors, the AMA, the APA, and the American Endocrine Society . I didn't ask for a LGBTQ+ child...I'm a straight, white, married man, who happened into a circumstance that as a parent is extremely challenging. But as a father all I can hope for is my child's happiness and for the State not to make laws disenfranchising them and their rights (my rights as a parent).

What about the freedom to read? Books are being banned all over this country because they don't agree with someone's political, lifestyle, or religious views, that is not Freedom, that is fascism. If you don't want your kids to read about someone who is gay or black or somehow different, tell them not to.

I believe in the 2nd Amendment, and although I'm not a gun owner, I support gun rights, but like anything else it is not an absolute. Not a sane person would argue that every person in this country has the right to own a nuclear weapon. Or, should have the right to own and use ballistic missiles at their whim. So, it comes down to degrees. Weapons of war belong with the military, in my opinion, and reasonable people can debate where the lines are drawn.

Yes, I'm center-left - all the positions above are more center than truly left. I think the far left is just a ****ing crazy as the far right. And not too long ago I was able to have civil, albeit, animated discussions with my friends on the right and we would debate. It was always with respect. Now it is impossible. The rhetoric has gotten so vial and vitriolic that it winds up in a shouting match every time - and these are life long friends of mine. It seems I can only talk "politics" with those that agree with my point of view - which is both boring and non-productive. Typically, I stay off message boards and social media because I can't change opinions (which I won't today, I know.)

Small government is great until disasters happen, or wars happen, or an extreme political party begins to take away the rights we hold dear - although I will admit rights, sometimes like beauty, are in the eye of the beholder. Big government sucks because it is wasteful and slow and bureaucracies kill ingenuity and the soul. I don't have the answers, but I do know is that demonizing Americans (yes, I am a "true" American who loves his country deeply) because we happen to hold a different belief system or different values is the path to destroying the greatest country the world has ever seen and that would be a damn shame.

 

[clob94]

Freedom is subjective and always a compromise.

One person's "Freedom" to not wear seatbelts for example, then imposes on another's Freedom - to be free of the expense of caring for the disability that comes with that decision...or perhaps we should just let all the poor bastards that wind up with head injuries die in the streets - good riddance - unless of course it is your mom, or your sister, or you.

Why should my rights as an adult human be trampled on because of someone else's religious beliefs - yet if I were to impregnate my wife (even though protection was used) that fetus' rights some how trump mine and my wife's rights in this state - what business is it of the State to tell me how or when I should procreate and how I should make decisions with my doctor and my partner?

Why can't my non-binary, transgender, gay child be allowed to choose their identity without bigotry, bias, or the state creating laws to decide that their healthcare choice is somehow "endangering" them, when it is in fact the exact opposite - this is a position supported by most doctors, the AMA, the APA, and the American Endocrine Society . I didn't ask for a LGBTQ+ child...I'm a straight, white, married man, who happened into a circumstance that as a parent is extremely challenging. But as a father all I can hope for is my child's happiness and for the State not to make laws disenfranchising them and their rights (my rights as a parent).

What about the freedom to read? Books are being banned all over this country because they don't agree with someone's political, lifestyle, or religious views, that is not Freedom, that is fascism. If you don't want your kids to read about someone who is gay or black or somehow different, tell them not to.

I believe in the 2nd Amendment, and although I'm not a gun owner, I support gun rights, but like anything else it is not an absolute. Not a sane person would argue that every person in this country has the right to own a nuclear weapon. Or, should have the right to own and use ballistic missiles at their whim. So, it comes down to degrees. Weapons of war belong with the military, in my opinion, and reasonable people can debate where the lines are drawn.

Yes, I'm center-left - all the positions above are more center than truly left. I think the far left is just a ****ing crazy as the far right. And not too long ago I was able to have civil, albeit, animated discussions with my friends on the right and we would debate. It was always with respect. Now it is impossible. The rhetoric has gotten so vial and vitriolic that it winds up in a shouting match every time - and these are life long friends of mine. It seems I can only talk "politics" with those that agree with my point of view - which is both boring and non-productive. Typically, I stay off message boards and social media because I can't change opinions (which I won't today, I know.)

Small government is great until disasters happen, or wars happen, or an extreme political party begins to take away the rights we hold dear - although I will admit rights, sometimes like beauty, are in the eye of the beholder. Big government sucks because it is wasteful and slow and bureaucracies kill ingenuity and the soul. I don't have the answers, but I do know is that demonizing Americans (yes, I am a "true" American who loves his country deeply) because we happen to hold a different belief system or different values is the path to destroying the greatest country the world has ever seen and that would be a damn shame.

I respect what you've said- but the polarization of politics done purposely by the establishment and the media is total and complete. There's no going back. When "they" started doing this to "us", I think their intentions were to create a "sports franchise" model- where both teams compete to beat each other in different "events" but at the end of the day, still like and respect each other.
I don't think "they" meant for it to go this far.

But it has. And like any abusive marriage, there's only 2 ways it ends.

 

[hornyheart]

I respect what you've said- but the polarization of politics done purposely by the establishment and the media is total and complete. There's no going back. When "they" started doing this to "us", I think their intentions were to create a "sports franchise" model- where both teams compete to beat each other in different "events" but at the end of the day, still like and respect each other.
I don't think "they" meant for it to go this far.

But it has. And like any abusive marriage, there's only 2 ways it ends.

So, Civil War? Man, that is both fatalistic and sad. Give up because it’s too hard? Doesn’t sound like the great American spirit to me. Sounds a bit snowflake-ish.

You sound like a rational human. Your way “they” win. America the beautiful as imperfect as she will always be is still better than any other country out there if we fight for her.

I wish you well, and hope if we ever meet you don’t blow my head off - I will be unarmed. lol.

 

[clob94]

So, Civil War? Man, that is both fatalistic and sad. Give up because it’s too hard? Doesn’t sound like the great American spirit to me. Sounds a bit snowflake-ish.

You sound like a rational human. Your way “they” win. America the beautiful as imperfect as she will always be is still better than any other country out there if we fight for her.

I wish you well, and hope if we ever meet you don’t blow my head off - I will be unarmed. lol.

I would like to point out that I offered two solutions. It was your prerogative to gravitate toward either of those two solutions.

You chose the violent one. Am I to read into that as a preference of yours? Again, any dimebook psychology guide would say that when given 2 choices and a person decides to single out 1, even if in mockery, they have a predilection to that choice.
I've said I am advocate for a peaceful divorce. I've said it for years. Going back the when Rick Perry was governor. I can see the writing on the walls. Yes, we are Americans. Yes, we are supposed to be "different" than the rest of the worlds citizens.
But we are also humans. And there's no escaping human nature. It's biology, bro. It's science. (Trust the science??)
I've seen other countries go down this road. (Granted, none like America)
But I've watched first hand, in a couple of instances. The rhetoric is the same. Muslims in northern Sudan vs Christians in southern Sudan. Two TOTALLY separate, non-blending ideologies- at contretemps. The bloodshed ended up being other worldly. There's 50 million people between those 2 nations and over 1% of the population was killed. Poof. Massacre. That's 5 DKRs filled with dead bodies.
Everybody saw it coming. The rhetoric. The media stoked it. The outside entities fanned the flames. USAID flat the fvck out told us "these fvckimg guys hate each other and there's no going back". Then one day, boom- the Bentiu massacre happens and it goes from bad to worstest-est.

This is where we, America, is/are right now. Politicians used to be made fun of by the media- both sides of the aisle. Remember Dana Carvey doing Bush and Phil Hartman doing Clinton?
Then one day the media shifted and got nasty. Then nastier. Then they just stopped making fun of one President altogether (because he was a black man and that was a touchy area). And now look- there's a 24 hour media news cycle that's been going on non-stop for 9 years, full blast, no-holds-barred sh!t show where "if you're not on OUR side, your a racist, Marxist, xenophobe, homophobe, deplorable."
Bruh- I've fancied myself a Reagan Democrat from the time I was 12 years old. I haven't shifted much on ANY issue for 30 plus years. Don't care who married whom. Don't give a sh!t what you do to your body (just don't ask me to pay for it). Stay off my fvcking lawn and nobody gets hurt.

But now I'M the bad guy.
This is Spain 1936. This is Sudan 2014. Algeria 1992.
We WERE unique and exceptional. We WERE the poster child for what a constitutional republic can do. And we can be one again.

How?

Peaceful divorce.

 

[outhereincali]

I would like to point out that I offered two solutions. It was your prerogative to gravitate toward either of those two solutions.

You chose the violent one. Am I to read into that as a preference of yours? Again, any dimebook psychology guide would say that when given 2 choices and a person decides to single out 1, even if in mockery, they have a predilection to that choice.
I've said I am advocate for a peaceful divorce. I've said it for years. Going back the when Rick Perry was governor. I can see the writing on the walls. Yes, we are Americans. Yes, we are supposed to be "different" than the rest of the worlds citizens.
But we are also humans. And there's no escaping human nature. It's biology, bro. It's science. (Trust the science??)
I've seen other countries go down this road. (Granted, none like America)
But I've watched first hand, in a couple of instances. The rhetoric is the same. Muslims in northern Sudan vs Christians in southern Sudan. Two TOTALLY separate, non-blending ideologies- at contretemps. The bloodshed ended up being other worldly. There's 50 million people between those 2 nations and over 1% of the population was killed. Poof. Massacre. That's 5 DKRs filled with dead bodies.
Everybody saw it coming. The rhetoric. The media stoked it. The outside entities fanned the flames. USAID flat the fvck out told us "these fvckimg guys hate each other and there's no going back". Then one day, boom- the Bentiu massacre happens and it goes from bad to worstest-est.

This is where we, America, is/are right now. Politicians used to be made fun of by the media- both sides of the aisle. Remember Dana Carvey doing Bush and Phil Hartman doing Clinton?
Then one day the media shifted and got nasty. Then nastier. Then they just stopped making fun of one President altogether (because he was a black man and that was a touchy area). And now look- there's a 24 hour media news cycle that's been going on non-stop for 9 years, full blast, no-holds-barred sh!t show where "if you're not on OUR side, your a racist, Marxist, xenophobe, homophobe, deplorable."
Bruh- I've fancied myself a Reagan Democrat from the time I was 12 years old. I haven't shifted much on ANY issue for 30 plus years. Don't care who married whom. Don't give a sh!t what you do to your body (just don't ask me to pay for it). Stay off my fvcking lawn and nobody gets hurt.

But now I'M the bad guy.
This is Spain 1936. This is Sudan 2014. Algeria 1992.
We WERE unique and exceptional. We WERE the poster child for what a constitutional republic can do. And we can be one again.

How?

Peaceful divorce.

I gotta ask are you saying that's it's ok if Texas seceeds from the union?