Did Horns (here) really want expansion
- Thread starter 12375CAT
- Start date
This guy wants expansion to 12 or 14. Problem is, the pickings are slim.
If the Horns had wanted expansion, there would have been expansion. They didn't, so there wasn't. The death certificate is all ready to go, even know the date now. Kansas will be ok, but the other 7 just voted to kill their programs today. Annual football TV dollars will drop from $30M to around $3M. They are so used to bending over when Texas walks in the room, they dropped their pants before knowing what this means for their future.
Brilliant.
Brilliant.
Adding a few mid-majors with tiny fan bases wasn't ever going to save a number of current Big 12 members from ending up as mid-majors themselves in the coming years.
As to the OP, I didn't want expansion, and I want Texas out of this dump of a league as soon as possible.
Texas handled this well. Boren looks like a complete moron. They got the little guys to vote unanimously against it. Pushing Houston scared the little guys who live off Houston second and third tier players. It was pretty brilliant. Why would Texas piss off ESPN and Fox when they have nothing to gain. Whoever is pulling the strings of the BIG12 commissioner is a huge improvement over Dodds and the guy who hired Strong.
The complete cluster that is the BIG12 even helps with the divorce. You won't even get stuck paying for the kids (tech, baylor, tcu), because your ex is obviously nuts. Well done.
You guys should be excited.
Go back over to your aggy board and run your smack. If the Big 12 couldn't add a major player, there was no need to expand the conference just for the sake of adding teams. Bottom line is there were no major/serious candidates to consider. There were best suited to stand pat.
Nope. Not now.
I DID want expansion back when the ACC was looking a little shaky. In fact, I think the powers that be really screwed the conference's chances of lasting all that long when they didn't, and yeah, I'm fine pointing fingers at DeLoss on that one if he were involved with that in his "Notre Dame or bust" stuff. (For what it's worth, I think almost everything else he did for UT's athletic department was pretty good, but there were a few different strategies that could have yielded results and secured the Big 12's place in the future of college football. They weren't taken, and the rest of the candidates, while most offer some aspect or another that the Big 12 is looking for, don't tick enough of the boxes of what would actually help the conference.
BYU might have been the most complete candidate, expanding the footprint, having a bit of clout as a program that is often considered Power-5 level, having a large fanbase that extends beyond the conference boundaries on all sides, etc., but they certainly don't help WVU feel like they made the right choice in joining a distant conference, there were looming scheduling conflicts and questions about whether other sports would join, and of course there's the fact that you need another school, or 3 more... not just 1.
Houston, as good as they've been, only really helps the Big 12 with one thing they need. They currently have a strong team and have for a couple years now. And this season in particular, the Big 12 could use an extra team that is playing well. That's pretty much it though. The way the TV networks look at things, the city of Houston is already a place where cable customers want to be able to see Texas, Oklahoma, Tech, and to some extent oSu, Baylor, and TCU on TV. It validates the program more, meaning that a state already being recruited by several power-5 programs from several conferences has another to compete with. They wouldn't have had the clout to overcome Ohio State, Florida State, Oregon or Alabama any more than TCU or Baylor were able to. It basically would be the short term reflex to us having a bad season across the conference... that would ultimately do nothing aside from speed the dissolution of the conference, except that there would be more voting members to complicate the process.
About the only really viable plan was the big gamble of going to 14 teams in big markets and hope that their progress to being a more powerful team would be quick, and that sports media and the playoff committee wouldn't see them as watering down the conference in the meantime. There's a chance this would have worked... Cincy, Memphis, UCF, USF... or... replace one of those with someone else... Tulane? Temple? UConn? even BYU? But it would have been a gamble, and it working out would have been a far bigger benefit to those Big 12 teams who don't really have a viable escape route at this point.
As a Texas fan (like with Oklahoma fans), there's a decent chance we'll be leaving anyway and new members before we leave would, at best, not really change that and at worst might complicate some of the votes that occur between now and then. If that happens, it will just be a question of where we land, and who gets out with us. Right now it seems like Oklahoma State, Texas Tech, and Kansas are the most likely to get lucky, but that depends on where everyone is going... and I can imagine scenarios where almost any of the schools (but not all of them) make it somewhere cozy.
I would have preferred that some incarnation of the Big 12 survive as a power conference, (and I still think that expanding with Miami, FSU, Clemson, GA Tech, Notre Dame, and... someone that Notre Dame wanted to add to sweeten the deal... Louisville for closeness, Pitt for rivalry history, Navy to keep their annual game going, or whatever... could have happened if we'd had a more proactive commissioner who went after them with the right vision or went to the SEC and Big 10 with a cooperative vision to undo the ACC... because even if everyone didn't get exactly who they wanted, there would have been plenty to go around) but at this point it doesn't seem like any of the expansion candidates do much to change the fate of the conference. It will likely come undone as the GOR comes up or if something else pushes enough other schools to move on it earlier... or it will get past this particularly bad season and bounce back to hang around longer through something unforeseen.
Yeah! What he said, only shorter!
Texas needs to cling to the Big 12. Options:
1. Beg Aggy to get in the SEC (has to be unanimous vote)
2. Join Big 10 and play Purdue, Northwestern and Minnesota and Illinois. each year..in cold weather
3. PAC...and have games on at midnight and fade to oblivion
4. ACC..no rivalry there, plus bottom of conference really sucks.
1. Beg Aggy to get in the SEC (has to be unanimous vote)
2. Join Big 10 and play Purdue, Northwestern and Minnesota and Illinois. each year..in cold weather
3. PAC...and have games on at midnight and fade to oblivion
4. ACC..no rivalry there, plus bottom of conference really sucks.
Nah, Gentleman's agreement wouldn't come into play should the SEC be a desired landing spot... Aggy pipe dream.
ACC is a great landing spot if you get ND to go all in. It's not just about football.
B1G makes perfect sense if it's a package deal of OU whom would need Texas help and Texas.
You can shit in one hand and want in the other when it comes to the PAC, that deal only made sense if it was a pod scenario with 4 current teams making the move.
Backing away slowly. Sorry if I went overboard. But I truly believe this worked out well for Texas. Whether by plan or accident doesn't matter much.
If we wanted into the sec (we've been invited 5 times over the last 23 years) we could make it happen. But the ONLY way I'd consider it was if the current programs voted unanimously to boot aggy prior to us coming in. I'd give up the LHN if that would happen.
Of course it was by design. Texas defines the Big 12 Aggies are defined by the SEC. If UT wanted it would have happened. UT will stand pat until 2025 then make their decision. In the meantime we will continue to make boat loads of money and steal U of H's coach. All in a days work. Aggy's dreams end in Tuscaloosa per usual.
We are in with ESPN until 2031. If Texas leaves the Big 12, the school must keep the terms of the present agreement, provide ESPN an exclusive 60-day window to negotiate for the other media rights and allow ESPN a 48-hour window to match any offer. That means ESPN would have exclusive access to tier 1 and 2 rights. A prohibition on licensing content to third parties, prevents Texas from participation non ESPN networks. If we leave before 2031 its SEC or ACC.
BIG for me if OU comes with. Yea, there are some smaller schools but also OSU, MU, MSU, PSU, and NU. All stadiums that beat anything we get in the Big12. In BBall, it's awesome. Playing in the cold in November sucks, but getting to play in front of 100K fans makes up for it.
There will be 4-16 team conferences within the next 10 years. It is irrelevant what Texas did/wants to do as far as the Big XII is concerned. This was once a great conference that was decimated because of the egos of Texas, Nebraska, and Texas A&M...no biggie.
The main 4 conferences will be the SEC, ACC, Pac, and B1G. I would assume that Texas and OU go North...
The main 4 conferences will be the SEC, ACC, Pac, and B1G. I would assume that Texas and OU go North...
There are a lot of considerations to this issue. Short travel times and more regional rivalries. Academics and the culture of that conference. Relatively few power differences between schools. A relatively common set of sports (do you compete in ice hockey and lacrosse, e.g.?).
No school is going to check all the boxes. Just consider what the Big 12 has right now: Texas and OU are the big dogs, the academics vary widely, and WVU doesn't fit, geographically.
So, am I glad BYU or a Florida school weren't invited? Yes. Not so sure about Houston or Cincinnati, either.
No school is going to check all the boxes. Just consider what the Big 12 has right now: Texas and OU are the big dogs, the academics vary widely, and WVU doesn't fit, geographically.
So, am I glad BYU or a Florida school weren't invited? Yes. Not so sure about Houston or Cincinnati, either.
SEC won't let Texas and Oklahoma go to the B1G without a fight.
The fact is that it will make the B1G too powerful and tip the balance of power away from them.
BTW, the days of big money TV contracts is coming to an end. The days of TV are coming to an end. I am a good example. I don't have cable TV or Satillite service and I never miss a second of anything. I have my desktop computer connected to my TV and I am streaming everything I want. There will always be those that want package deals and that will make cable and satellite TV still a viable option but ROKU, ESPN all access, HBO now, Netflix, and even VUDU have made life without a 100 dollar TV bill very pleasant.
The fact is that it will make the B1G too powerful and tip the balance of power away from them.
BTW, the days of big money TV contracts is coming to an end. The days of TV are coming to an end. I am a good example. I don't have cable TV or Satillite service and I never miss a second of anything. I have my desktop computer connected to my TV and I am streaming everything I want. There will always be those that want package deals and that will make cable and satellite TV still a viable option but ROKU, ESPN all access, HBO now, Netflix, and even VUDU have made life without a 100 dollar TV bill very pleasant.
Just takes a 2/3 vote to kick Aggie to the curb.
2014-2015 SEC CONSTITUTION & BYLAWS
3.1 MEMBERSHIP, TERMINATION, SUSPENSION
*3.1.2 Granting of Membership. Membership may be granted by invitation of the Conference at a meeting of the Chief Executive Officers. A vote of at least three-fourths of the members is required to extend an invitation for membership.
*3.1.4 Termination of Membership. Membership may be terminated voluntarily by the resignation of a member or involuntarily at a meeting of the Chief Executive Officers. A vote of at least two-thirds of the members is required to terminate membership. Any motion to terminate membership shall specify the effective date of the proposed termination.
SEC Bylaws
Hook 'em*3.1.4 Termination of Membership. Membership may be terminated voluntarily by the resignation of a member or involuntarily at a meeting of the Chief Executive Officers. A vote of at least two-thirds of the members is required to terminate membership. Any motion to terminate membership shall specify the effective date of the proposed termination.
SEC Bylaws
Damn, that would be glorious to see.
Can you imagine the look on their faces. It's like a fat guy gets a date with a hot girl and in the middle of the date, a hot guy just walks up and takes here.
Talk about scarred for life, aggsy might go full on Jones town.
Holy mother fvcking guacamole.
How much eternal butt hurt would this cause aggy?
It would be like getting away with rape/murder on a genocidal level. I would have to invest in like-- 10 oil tankers to save up all those aggy tears for drinking later. Hell I could take daily baths in aggy tears for a mellinium.
BYU's Olympic sports are in the west coast conference, NDs Olympic sports are in the ACC. If we go independent in football we need a landing spot for our Olympic sports. Not sure there is an enitiy out there that would do the NBC ND deal with us. CBS is locked in with the SEC, ABC/ESPN already have us not sure if they would break the bank for Tier 1 and Tier 2. Fox is desperate for content but they just inked a big deal with the B1G and we are locked into ESPN until 2031.
I would say ESPN would go big for Texas if it could sign us, especially since it knows it will gain a lot more money by not having to carry the Big 12 like it does.
Give Texas 30 to 40 million a year for Tier 1 and 2 and you make it up by not having to give KSU and ISU 20 million.
Give Texas 30 to 40 million a year for Tier 1 and 2 and you make it up by not having to give KSU and ISU 20 million.
I didn't really care. I'm ok with the idea of keeping the big 12 together. I'm ok with the idea of moving conferences in 2025. The only think I don't want is to move to the Pac 12. I cant stand the 9pm (or later) kickoffs.
I'm not going to get into all the nuts and bolts of TV contracts, but if you look ahead to 2025, the days of bundled cable packages (and cable at all) are going to be over. That means people aren't going to be forced to subscribe to conference networks (or any network, for that matter) We may find out that it was prudent not to bind ourselves to small, unmarketable programs just to add teams.
I'm not going to get into all the nuts and bolts of TV contracts, but if you look ahead to 2025, the days of bundled cable packages (and cable at all) are going to be over. That means people aren't going to be forced to subscribe to conference networks (or any network, for that matter) We may find out that it was prudent not to bind ourselves to small, unmarketable programs just to add teams.
Like was said above, both have conferences for all the other sports outside of football. Texas would need the same kind of situation. BYU doesn't mind having their non-football sports in a smaller conference of religious-based universities, so that works for them but Texas has too much pride in their basketball, baseball, volleyball, golf, tennis, swimming, etc., to be ok with putting them in Conference USA or the Southland Conference, or anything like that.
They'd likely have to find a power-5 conference that would agree to take ONLY their non-football sports the way the ACC did with Notre Dame. And truth be told, the "football deal" of having to play said conference 4 to 6 times a season (Notre Dame has to play the ACC 5 times) wouldn't be the world thing in the world... the problem is, which conference would agree to that? The Big 10 never agreed to that kind of deal with Notre Dame. It's doubtful they ever would change their mind on that. I doubt the SEC would agree to that kind of thing either. The ACC seems the most likely to make the deal (since they did that with Notre Dame already anyway).
Unfortunately there's a problem with that. The administration at UT has been pretty vocal about the issues with sending our non-football sports halfway across the country on a weekly basis. Football is one thing... it's almost always Saturday, and there are only 12 to 15 games a season. Every other sport has week-day games regularly and has a lot more games or meets or matches or whatever. They miss class. They miss even more class when the event is in New Jersey or Massachusetts or Washington. And if you're just adding the non-football sports to the Pac 12 or Big 10 or ACC, you're likely not helping make arrangements to bring "travel partners" with you. If you're joining full time to one of those conferences, you're probably looking at bringing other Texas, Oklahoma, or Kansas schools with you, which helps make the travel at least a little bit better.
It's just a really complicated situation, and unlike Notre Dame, we aren't as close, distance-wise, to some of the members in the less stable conferences. I know there are TV issues that would need to be worked through, but when it's all said and done I think we're most likely to be in the East division of the new Pac 16, or in either the west division (or some kind of pod system) or the Big 10++ (which might be 18 members large or something like that). The SEC and the ACC seem less likely, but the SEC might be the 3rd most likely, if for no other reason than the ACC just makes it that much tougher to expand in a way that makes sense travel-wise if the administrators are at all serious about looking out for non-football travel. It gets really weird trying to come up with a way to add Texas "travel partners" to the ACC, while one could imagine 2 or 3 out of Kansas or Oklahoma or Rice or Tulane joining the Big 10 with Texas, along with looking into Notre Dame.
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