How many folks here have either lost their job or had spouse/immediate family lose their jobs? I’m fortunate but the longer this mess drags on the worse it’ll get as far as unemployment goes across the board.
Lost jobs from Coronavirus chaos
- Thread starter Belldozer1
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Too early to tell Bell, but I would not be surprised if in 2 months, most of the work force is out of work. Even if they find the cure tomorrow the damage is done.I suspect that many bars and resturants are already out of business no matter what. Those outfits employ many people.The cash flow situation is drying up faster than you can believe. Clob was right.....invest in bullets and get ready to hunker down.
I think when this thing peaks in the next 3 days the numbers are going to be way lower that what the knee jerk crowd was pushing. Once that happens look for the floodgates to open of folks getting back to work. Some areas may be effected like you point out.
It’s happening my friends, none too soon and much to the chagrin of some I’m sure but that’s too bad. Time to get the economy back on track headed into the election. Who doesn’t want a strong prosperous country and economy?
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...es-essential-workers-exposed-coronavirus.html
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...es-essential-workers-exposed-coronavirus.html
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Bell...I am not basing my gloomy thoughts on the virus projections one way or another. I am down on what will be on the other side. As far as I know there is not one car maker in the US that is still making cars. Ford, Honda, Tesla, GM etc have all simply stopped.All the companies that make the widgets for those cars have also had to quit. Shopping malls may never reopen to what they were before. All the investment companies that operated RIATS that own those malls......shopping centers, etc have no income whatever.
Sure, when they blow the "all clear" many folks will be able to get back to work, but not everybody. Many companies will simply not be there to rehire furloughed workers.
I hope I am wrong. I also believe there will be amazing opportunity on the other side as well.
Sure, when they blow the "all clear" many folks will be able to get back to work, but not everybody. Many companies will simply not be there to rehire furloughed workers.
I hope I am wrong. I also believe there will be amazing opportunity on the other side as well.
I understand your point but what I’m saying is the stats clearly show this silly virus has an extremely low mortality rate. Why force mandatory shelter in place on folks when we don’t do it for the flu? Why not give folks an option? If you feel vulnerable and want to shelter in place, good for you, doesn’t bother me but by making it mandatory is an over reaction by the medical community imo and is severely and unnecessarily effecting the economy.
And btw I had a cousin die of cancer last week, he was part of the 7700 that die in the US everyday, when you take that into consideration surely everyone looking at this objectively can see how silly this whole panic exercise is.
im still going to work everyday by choice not because I’m being forced to. I refuse to be a part of the overacting.
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Speaking of silly viruses......
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...hands-coronavirus-pandemic-says-Dr-Fauci.html
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...hands-coronavirus-pandemic-says-Dr-Fauci.html
Bell....I could not agree more with your position as far as over reacting.....but low mortality rate? I don't know if the numbers reported about the flu include only "confirmed" cases or not but the death numbers from flu show somewhere around .02%.....The death cases from Corona show over 3%.....about 100 times higher. That is scary bad.
The issue is that anyone that gets corona and dies is counted as a Corona virus death. They may have had Corona but really died from something else. I don't know if the counted flu deaths are treated the same way.
Lies....damned lies ….and statistics....we may never know the real story. The only thing I am sure of is that NOBODY is telling the truth.
The issue is that anyone that gets corona and dies is counted as a Corona virus death. They may have had Corona but really died from something else. I don't know if the counted flu deaths are treated the same way.
Lies....damned lies ….and statistics....we may never know the real story. The only thing I am sure of is that NOBODY is telling the truth.
Good points. I’m just curious how the government will continue sending out social security checks if it’s going to be as bad as what you’re projecting?
projecting?....I don't think I am projecting anything.....but to answer your question....I am pretty certain the govt will keep sending out SS checks( as long as there is a viable govt)…..I am just not sure if those checks will be worth anything. All these govt give aways could lead to runaway inflation.
My wife's business is completely shut down. A retail shop and 4 vacation rentals. She's basically unemployed because of this. It sucks because this is the beginning of the tourist season in New Braunfels. If this doesn't open up soon, she'll pretty much have to write off 2020. That's a 6 figure income loss for our household. Fortunately, I have a full time job so we'll be fine but shutting down the whole economy over this is utterly stupid. We're going to look back at this in a few years and realize how dumb it was to react like we did. They are unquestionably juicing up the death count. Fauci and Birx admitted that yesterday. No matter the underlying condition if you have Corona they consider that the cause of death. You could have Stage 4 cancer and a knife through the heart but if you tested positive for Corona then you died of Corona. So the already ridiculous low death rate is actually even much lower. Just absolutely insane.
@Drtxhorn i could almost have written your post verbatim and it would fit my scenario .
This doesn’t apply to me per se but I’m sure you’re keeping tabs on this. I spoke to this gentlemen, nice guy.
https://www.expressnews.com/business/local/amp/Homeowners-sue-New-Braunfels-over-15180404.php
I hope these plaintiffs prevail. It pretty much boils down to private property rights. The city attorney smugly states there's a process to get it rezoned but she misses the point entirely. Their zoning process is so restrictive that it's nearly impossible to get it rezoned. That's not a fair process and deprives the property owner of a reasonable use of their own property. The real issue is the city of NB has a wink wink deal with all the major hotel operators in the city to keep these restrictions in place. Same crap happened in Austin and every major tourist area once short term rentals started to become popular.
The city is fixing to have a problem, this attorney Stewart, knows his business and won this case that set a lot of other cases in motion. He’s coming hard. Oh and btw, this new case against the City was filed in Federal Court to bypass the good ol’ boy connections in Comal County.
https://thejuristlawgroup.com/tarr-v-timberwood-park-owners-association-the-vacationers-next-door
Santa Clara County official (home of the 49er's) says no sports until THANKSGIVING. I don't want to overreact, but I have a feeling this is where the civil war erupts --- Trump says back to work, and the left controlled areas say no. Gundy says spring practice starts May 1. Is it possible for NCAA to say screw it, we're having a season, even if shortened, without the PAC 12? Or have some individual conferences play their seasons, and others not?
https://dknation.draftkings.com/202...ers-stadium-san-jose-sharks-stanford-football
https://dknation.draftkings.com/202...ers-stadium-san-jose-sharks-stanford-football
Looks bad for NCAA schools if no football played.
"Sports other than football and men’s basketball cost Power 5 athletic departments more than $960 million, (roughly $17 million a school) in 2018, Sports Illustrated reported. Football brought in about $28.2 million per Power Five program.
“I don’t know how any of us, how the current NCAA model, could survive if we’re not playing any football games,” Pollard told the Post.
“It’s hard today to wrap your head around how challenging that would be, if we can’t play any football games,” Pollard added. “We’d essentially be bankrupt.”
https://www.sacbee.com/sports/college/article241883881.html
"Sports other than football and men’s basketball cost Power 5 athletic departments more than $960 million, (roughly $17 million a school) in 2018, Sports Illustrated reported. Football brought in about $28.2 million per Power Five program.
“I don’t know how any of us, how the current NCAA model, could survive if we’re not playing any football games,” Pollard told the Post.
“It’s hard today to wrap your head around how challenging that would be, if we can’t play any football games,” Pollard added. “We’d essentially be bankrupt.”
https://www.sacbee.com/sports/college/article241883881.html
Drtxhorn….I don't have a dog in the fight, and I don't know how the area has changed in the last 30 years....but frankly....to me you are talking about carpet bagger rights. If I lived next door to that house and had done so all my life, I would be mad as hell if they allowed short term rentals.As I said....I havnt been to that area in over 30 years and maybe there are no long term locals there anyway. I am just saying that private property rights go both ways.
I merely comment out of boredom. Feel free to explain the error of my thinking.I will not be offended.
I merely comment out of boredom. Feel free to explain the error of my thinking.I will not be offended.
Regardless of the mortality rate, there is also the rate at which infected people will need hospitalization or further yet , ICU beds and/or ventilators. THe dead bodies aren't overwhelming the system, it's the people theyre trying to keep alive. And one thing nobody is talking about right now is how many of those folks wont be able to pay the bill when it comes. I suspect we may run into more medical debt related bankruptcies than usual. On top of that we have sick folks who cant afford care who are just trying to tough it out. Leading to more unnecessary sicknesses.
I dont have a huge problem with giving people an option - however that would mean that we have to trust people to do the right thing. And history shows us that many people dont care about the right thing in a crisis like this. Keep in mind how easily you can contract covid19, show no symptoms while still being able to infect people whose immune system cant handle this as well. We live in a time where you can die from a 10 minute old sneeze cloud you walked into. I would ask what do you know that counters what all the experts around the world are saying about how to address this crisis? Ideas are good.
ok points taken but let me ask you what’s so different about this that you can’t say about the annual flu deaths? Do you think that all of the tens of thousands of folks that die from the flu every year die at home? No, no they don’t. They don’t go from healthy one day to dying of the flu 20 minutes later, there’s a progression and they seek medical help just like what’s happening now. The problem is that the medical industry has infused sheer panic into the equation and anyone have a flu like symptom now runs to the ER like a bunch of titty babies. How many hundreds of thousands of cases of flu were reported last year?
Most flu victims die from pneumonia. So how on earth are the hospitals not inundated every year the flu rolls around? Do you think this may be getting a little over sensationalized? I do. Couple the annual flu deaths along with 7700 Americans dying everyday of everything you can think of. Stand back and ask your self why all of this world shutdown for Coronavirus but not the other stuff? Then get back to work.
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Why long term renters over short term renters? A rental is a rental. Why is one considered a business and ones not if you are using it for residential purposes?
I completely understand why neighbors would be irritated if there were constant parties happening next door or across the street from me. I would be upset too. That's a legitimate issue but I believe there are ample remedies to address those situations when they arise. If a guest is not disturbing anyone there's no issue. 90% of the time the guests are couples or young families who are respectful and considerate. All short term rental agreements specifically prohibit using the home for large parties and gatherings. Those who violate the agreement forego their full deposit. Also, if they are disturbing the peace they risk being cited by the police as does the property owner. The fact is that the party house scenario that all these cities and HOA's always bring up is just simply a strawman. That stuff very rarely happens nowadays.
How many times have you automatically kept your distance from someone who is sick with the flu? If someone comes to work sick, what do you do? You send them home. I don't know of anyone who says they plan to go visit someone that has the flu. The point is that we already practice social distancing by using common sense and respect for others. We do this instinctively. We don't need a govt authority to tell us this.
The other key factor in all of this is the insurance reimbursement scheme for doctors and hospitals. The reason they want Covid 19 as the cause of death is because it comes with a much larger payout. Especially if they used a ventilator. The difference is in the tens of thousands per patient. Being hospitalized for the flu is approximately a $13k insurance payout while a Covid 19 hospitalization is a little over $40k.
Always follow the money.
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What's different that you cant say about annual flu deaths- Not sure what you mean. The flu has an incubation period of a couple days, with very few asymptomatic cases. Meaning it is easier to track community spread. We also have decades of research on the flu, and have been able to develop vaccines for most strains when they mutate and come back every year. This is a novel corona virus, meaning we have never seen it before. We have little in terms of options for treating infected folks. Plus it's an infection that causes severe respiratory distress that can end a person who would easily survive the flu. I mean, the experts are saying this stuff, and who am i to say the experts are lying? Most people who think this way arent qualified to even have those opinions.
The medical industry hasnt infused panic- that's the media. The medical experts are generally not trying to panic everyone, they are wanting us to take an abundance of caution because they know how sideways this can go. When have you seen Fauci causing panic? Birx? I havent seen it. Regular people dont have an education in the medical sciences.. THese folks, this is all they do, it's their entire life. I dont argue with the mechanic who is fixing my car.
Hospitals dont get inundated with flu people because a smaller percentage of people who get the flu actually need hospitalization. Another consideration is that the flu happens over the course of a whole season, our first corona case was not even 3 months ago and look where it's at now. I did some research in the 17-18 flu season- we had about 810,000 hospitalizations in the country for the whole season. Out of about 45 million cases. That's 1.8%. With covid19, CDC estimates hospitalization rate of 4.6%. They define it as being hospitalized for symptoms within 14 days of a positive covid 19 diagnosis.So we could be looking at as many as twice as many hospitalizations in this short period of time than the flu gives us during the whole season for a condition that has a higher mortality rate. This may not bother you or other individuals. But it bothers people whose jobs that are to look out for public health.
Is it oversensationalized? Sure, the media makes big money oversensationalizig things. I dont listen to them, I do however pay very close attention to what experts are saying though. On the other hand, we have many people who are the opposite and not taking it seriously enough. Oh this kills people? Yeah right, it wont kill me. That's a common thought by many people i have discussed this with.
Ive been working 60 hour weeks for the past month, dont tell me to get back to work. As far as why is the world shutdown, it's not because it's a big conspiracy by rich people hell bent on world domination.
So, fewer people with the flu need hospitalization but every year tens of thousands of people die of the flu. Do they die at home? Dude listen, use your best judgment is all I can tell you. I’m living life not living in fear. I wash my hands , take showers but I also realize that at some point in my lifetime I’m going to die. Will it be Coronavirus? Will it be the flu? Will it be a car wreck or cancer? Who knows all I can say is I don’t believe mandatory shutdowns are realistic unless we want the economy to totally crater I’d say to Americans as a whole toughen up and make the best of your situation . If you get the virus, you get it.
Well aware that many thousands die from the flu every year. That is an established fact. Do they die at home? Sure, some might.
I am listening, thanks for the sage advice, nobody has ever suggested these things- wash my hands, take showers. Incredible insight. Thanks.
I understand you dont think mandatory shutdowns are realistic. Cool. I could show you charts and data that would give a reasonable minded person enough information to show the direct coorelation of infections between shutdowns/social distancing vs not taking those measures. Bottom line this path we are taking is the quickest way to get it behind us and in the rear view mirror. But i suspect it wouldnt matter to you.
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Well why ask if you’ve already made up your mind that you believe an extended shutdown is the way to go. So an extended shut down craters the economy leads to 40%-50% unemployment for something that a very small percentage are dying from. No, you’re right I’m not ok with that.
I never made up my mind that an extended shutdown is the way to go. That's an assumption you seem to have made about me.
I also never said anything about you being okay with whatever you described in this post. I feel you are possibly being intentionally obtuse.
You just posted above that you could show me charts and data and crystal ball showing me direct correlations between shutdowns / social distancing having an effect on Coronavirus vs doing nothing at all. Hey I agree about the social distancing. Where you and I are appearing to have a disconnect is that I’m very aware of the fact that if this damn shutdown were to go one for another month or longer, you and I won’t have a job to go back to and I have a huge issue with that, yes.
Yes indeed I did say i could show you such charts.
And you are making more assumptions. Not a good habit to have.
In my mind as this continued shutdown goes on here are my options:
1.) continue with the shutdown mentality keeping in mind some in the medical field are calling from anywhere from a couple more months to 12-18 months. Lose my job and every material thing I have worked for knowing the chances of me dying from this silly virus is pretty damn slim.
OR
2.) Having all shutdowns lifted except in very specific hot spots, take my chance of getting the virus (which just because you’re shutdown in no way guarantees you won’t get it) and surviving which 99.9% people do, keeping my job and enjoying life because the economy recovers etc.
Well, which one do you think I’m leaning towards?
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I know where you are leaning. But it's irrelevant because you dont make those decisions. As the data becomes available they'll be able to make informed decisions as to the appropriate timeline to get things back going with minimal risk of another wave hitting people who dont have immunity. We can follow the examples being set in the rest of the world as those nations recover. I think they know the danger of restarting too early and it would basically render the last month of hell basically worthless if it did go bad. Bad thing about stuff like this- you dont always know when they go overboard and and did more than was necessary. But, you always know when they didnt do enough.
I realize I don’t make those decisions, they’re being forced on me but regardless, the outcomes I listed above are going to be the outcomes for virtually everyone based upon what the medical industry folks are deciding for all of us, economy be damned
According to comments made by an actual expert and leader in the national response, Dr Fauci himself has never suggested anything close to the 12-18 months you mentioned earlier. But again, timelines evolve as the increases in cases/deaths trend down. Nobody knows when we can get back to 100% normal but we can get close
The End Game of the Bretton Woods agreement.
The anal ass raping that is about to occur is going to be monumental. The FED is printing like there is no tomorrow. They are buying junk bonds, lol. They are about to be buying stocks outright... lol. Bell, oil will be sky high in short order. What will not be sky high are the living conditions of all the laid off. Most of the small businesses will not come back. There are going to be shortages with HIGH inflation in short order. The jobs won't come back. All the old people on this forum, get ready. Your monthly check will not get an adjustment for inflation but you won't be able to afford the basics in the years to come. Time to learn to live off the land or be swept away by the cessation of free markets and inflation.
The anal ass raping that is about to occur is going to be monumental. The FED is printing like there is no tomorrow. They are buying junk bonds, lol. They are about to be buying stocks outright... lol. Bell, oil will be sky high in short order. What will not be sky high are the living conditions of all the laid off. Most of the small businesses will not come back. There are going to be shortages with HIGH inflation in short order. The jobs won't come back. All the old people on this forum, get ready. Your monthly check will not get an adjustment for inflation but you won't be able to afford the basics in the years to come. Time to learn to live off the land or be swept away by the cessation of free markets and inflation.
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