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Time for UT to make a power play for Herman..

Aggy=Nazi

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Nov 16, 2005
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I respect Charlie Strong as a man and teacher of young men. I was excited when he was hired and I would be perfectly fine with him coaching my Son if he was good enough to be recruited by UT.

With that said I have seen enough over the last 3 years regardless of the talent that UT has had to know that he is not the right coach for us long term. Her certainly can evaluate talent and can develop them, once he get's them into the program there is no denying that, but his hiring decisions, loyalty to friends, and his in game clock management and in game decision making is what I call into question. Also there is zero excuse for our poor Defensive play three years in a row when he is supposed to be a Defensive Guru and has won a championship as a D coordinator.

It is a rare when and up and coming coach with the potential to be the next Urban Meyer or Nick Saban becomes available or can be hired away. I believe that Tom Herman has what it takes to become the next best coach in college football and could very well be at UT for 15 plus years and could win multiple championships here. I believe if we do not make a run for him that he will go to USC or LSU and we will in the same position that were were at the end of Mack's tenure looking for another coach that is already committed to a big time program. It could be a huge mistake moving forward and not making a run at him. He has already stated that UT was his "dream school"

UT should make a power play to bring Herman in and pay whatever the buyouts are and whatever salary he would command. UT has the resources and money to be a top 5 program every year. It's all coaching, and I have seen enough from Strong to know that we will never take the next step with him at the helm.

It was over 30 years since UT won a championship before they won with VY. With the buzz from that one championship and many top 10 finishes in a row UT was able to establish it's self as the highest earning college football program in the land, and has remained so even during last 5 years when we have been struggling. Imagine how much more money the University would make if we were actually making the college football playoff with regularity. The money would be insane and would cover any costs of any buyout or new contract and then some.

Ultimately I want what's best for UT and I believe in the short term and long term Herman is our best option. There is certainly talent here unlike when Mack left.

Love to hear your thoughts on this..
 
We are too fractured to do something like that. If we had that kind of foresight and unity we would have done it years ago for Urban.

It's not rare for there to be a potential next Urban Meyer / Nick Saban on the board. It seems like there is a new name every year in that category. It is rare for those names to reach that potential. Rare as it hasn't happened yet.
 
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I respectfully disagree Bubba. I believe Tom Herman has shown as much as Urban Meyer or more when he hired away at UTAH. He has already won a conference title and beaten two football powerhouses with way lessor talent. He also won a championship as a O coordinator and has learned from one of the best all time. He turned U of H around immediately and has already recruited better there than any coach in their history in less than 2 years. Herman is the real deal and UT will regret not hiring him.
 
Oh I agree he's very good. IMO the idea that anyone is the next Urban / Saban isn't even a possibility. Those will be two of the greatest all time. It's the equivalent of saying someone is the second coming of VY. Just say they are really good and leave it that.

As far as UT making that kind of move we just don't do that. That's just not the way they roll good or bad.
 
I also didn't think we would ax Patterson after 1 year but we did. We also pushed out Mack when other wanted him to stay. I think the new decision makers at UT may be willing to do what was not done in the past. We are in a new era of college footbal We are already in a shitty conference, having a mediocre coach is unacceptable no matter how good of man he is. Time for us to adapt and strong arm. We have the resources.
 
It depends on our record. If the D is as bad as Cal we lose the next 3 of 4. OSU-L. OU- L ISU-W KSU-L. If it goes to shit I think our admin panics and fires Charlie mid way to make a play for Herman.
 
@Aggy=Nazi

Tell me whom I'm referring to:

Head coach at a mid major
Won a national title as a coordinator
Gained national attention by beating a highly ranked team from Florida in a BCS bowl game
Less than 55 games as a head coach
Brilliant mind as a coordinator
Loved and respected by his players
Awesome win loss record but not seasoned as a head coach-- just yet

Notice any similarities?

I was critical of Texas for hiring a coach with this limited resume. It would be hypocritical of me if I didn't feel the same way about Herman.
 
It depends on our record. If the D is as bad as Cal we lose the next 3 of 4. OSU-L. OU- L ISU-W KSU-L. If it goes to shit I think our admin panics and fires Charlie mid way to make a play for Herman.
ISU-W ?????

We are sleeping on Iowa state again this year? Dear lord I hope not........
 
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8-5 or less and I think hes gone IMO
Texas fires Strong forvgoing 8-5 playing 20+ freshman and Sophs including the QB good luck getting Herrman or any other big name. He wins 7 games I think it's worth a conversation. Any more than thst he's back.

The boosters and administration lost their chance at a big name imo when they chose loyalty to Mack over a run at Saban and urban, or hell even Harbaugh.
 
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Thanks Clob. I respect your opinion and enjoy reading your posts. I think I would be willing to take the chance with Herman. I think we have already seen enough of a sample size with Strong at UT to know hes not the guy. Just my opinion.
 
0% chance he's fired at 8-5. I think the conversation starts at 7 wins and increases as you go down in wins. For there to be a good chance of Strong being fired I think you have to see 6 wins, and even then there is still a significant chance he stays.

I am not arguing in support of that, but just that is how it goes at Texas. We just don't have a history of pulling the trigger until coaches are already on their last breath.
 
Well I guess we will continue with the status quo then and just keep firing assistants. For 5 million a year strong should take over the Defensive play calling at minimum.
 
@Aggy=Nazi

Tell me whom I'm referring to:

Head coach at a mid major
Won a national title as a coordinator
Gained national attention by beating a highly ranked team from Florida in a BCS bowl game
Less than 55 games as a head coach
Brilliant mind as a coordinator
Loved and respected by his players
Awesome win loss record but not seasoned as a head coach-- just yet

Notice any similarities?

I was critical of Texas for hiring a coach with this limited resume. It would be hypocritical of me if I didn't feel the same way about Herman.
I see what your saying Clob, but Herrman followed that up with a beat down of OU and has another big matchup with Louisville in a few weeks. Little doubt he can coach. I don't have much doubt in Strong honestly
 
ISU-W ?????

We are sleeping on Iowa state again this year? Dear lord I hope not........
I had Iowa state as a win and the other 3 as losses. If we lose the next 4 I can guarantee he will be gone mid season.
 
0% chance he's fired at 8-5. I think the conversation starts at 7 wins and increases as you go down in wins. For there to be a good chance of Strong being fired I think you have to see 6 wins, and even then there is still a significant chance he stays.

I am not arguing in support of that, but just that is how it goes at Texas. We just don't have a history of pulling the trigger until coaches are already on their last breath.

Let's see what happens when we go 8-5 and go to some shit bowl and the Aggies finish strong and make the playoff. I think the powers that be at UT will be singing a different tune.
 
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Let's see what happens when we go 8-5 and go to some shit bowl and the Aggies finish strong and make the playoff. I think the powers that be at UT will be singing a different tune.

Nah. I don't disagree with your disappointment but status quo is what we do here. Until I see otherwise that's where my money is.
 
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I don't see how a 3 win improvement(at least) off of last year is "status quo". Now if he goes 5-7, 6-6 and keeps his job THEN you can say status quo.
 
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Nope, but I'd like to see what Herman does. LSU would be a nice landing spot for him, but he's a Cali kid and if USC comes after him. I think he'll head West.

Unless this team finishes in a bad-bad way, Strong is back in 2017. Bank on it!
 
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I think LSU would be a perfect landing spot for Patrino. He would crush it there...
 
Texas fires Strong forvgoing 8-5 playing 20+ freshman and Sophs including the QB good luck getting Herrman or any other big name. He wins 7 games I think it's worth a conversation. Any more than thst he's back.

The boosters and administration lost their chance at a big name imo when they chose loyalty to Mack over a run at Saban and urban, or hell even Harbaugh.
Mack won 8 games with Case freaking McCoy and Mack was a consistently damn good recruiter. I think barring another 6 loss season this year tgen Texas may be tied to him for a couple more years. It will be interesting to see what Texas does with Charlie's contract expiring next year. Also, it was a good win for Houston but I'm really not sure how much of an accomplishment beating OU is this year. Having said that, I do think Herman is a good coach. If Charlie did get fired this year does anyone see Texas going after Miles or Briles?
 
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Nope, but I'd like to see what Herman does. LSU would be a nice landing spot for him, but he's a Cali kid and if USC comes after him. I think he'll head West.

Unless this team finishes in a bad-bad way, Strong is back in 2017. Bank on it!
Reportedly USC came calling last year and he said thanks but no
 
Reportedly USC came calling last year and he said thanks but no

I don't know if that's true, but if not, I doubt USC axes Helton after just 1 full season. Herman is going to be on top of every coaching vacancy wish list so he'll be snatched up before USC gets their S together.
 
Mack won 8 games with Case freaking McCoy and Mack was a consistently damn good recruiter. I think barring another 6 loss season this year tgen Texas may be tied to him for a couple more years. It will be interesting to see what Texas does with Charlie's contract expiring next year.
Yeah one thing I will say is this is a different Adminstrstion than the one that made those decisions. Hell its a different one than even hired Strong.

I'll say this I think whatever decssion they make I think you have to do it with an eye to the future. If you decide to keep strong it has to be for year 4, 5. and 6. Going in to 2017 with speculation about his job(again) that just creates problems and distractions.
 
@Aggy=Nazi

Tell me whom I'm referring to:

Head coach at a mid major
Won a national title as a coordinator
Gained national attention by beating a highly ranked team from Florida in a BCS bowl game
Less than 55 games as a head coach
Brilliant mind as a coordinator
Loved and respected by his players
Awesome win loss record but not seasoned as a head coach-- just yet

Notice any similarities?

I was critical of Texas for hiring a coach with this limited resume. It would be hypocritical of me if I didn't feel the same way about Herman.

The difference would be settling for Chuck (what was he? 3rd choice?) vs. getting the coach everyone wants.
 
His contract is meaningless imo. Losing games makes your seat hot not years left on your contract. Unless he was able to negotiate a ridiculous buyout they can fire him at any point anyway. If they want to keep him an additional year they will extend him with little buyout and axe him if it comes to that after the 2017 season.
 
His contract is meaningless imo. Losing games makes your seat hot not years left on your contract. Unless he was able to negotiate a ridiculous buyout they can fire him at any point anyway. If they want to keep him an additional year they will extend him with little buyout and axe him if it comes to that after the 2017 season.
If he goes on an 8-10'win season you gotta extend him. Name me a big time college program that lets its coach gomin to a contract year. I'm sure it's happened but it's rare.

If your the AD and you don't extend your coach after an 8-10 win season you don't beleive in him. At that point you should just move on
 
If he goes on an 8-10'win season you gotta extend him. Name me a big time college program that lets its coach gomin to a contract year. I'm sure it's happened but it's rare.

If your the AD and you don't extend your coach after an 8-10 win season you don't beleive in him. At that point you should just move on

I agree if they want him as coach in 2017 they will extend him, but my point is that regardless of his extension he is not guaranteed more seasons beyond 2017. At big time programs that can afford a buyout pretty much every coach is essentially on a year to year gig.
 
I don't understand the personal attachment to coach A or coach B. I am attached to winning. Win and you are my coach. Lose and you are not. It's all quantitative and not qualitative.
Yup....5 MILLION A YEAR....screw sentimental attachments :). UT has got a horrible return on that investment so far. Pay off Strong or pay up for Herman.
 
I don't understand the personal attachment to coach A or coach B. I am attached to winning. Win and you are my coach. Lose and you are not. It's all quantitative and not qualitative.
I don't agree completely. You are right college football is about winning. However you have to have realistic expectations. You can't throw a coach in to a dumpster fire and then say "oh you didn't win? Time to make a change". Your roster dictates how much you win more than anything. Strongsfirst two years hear it was a 5-7 win roster. Coaching is worth one maybe two wins and can make a difference in close games, but your roster dictates what you are.

I'll use Urban Meyer as an example

Ron zook went 8-5 twice and 7-4 before getting the Ax at Flordia. Urban took that roster in his first year went 9-3. Wasn't really that much of an improvement.

So this is no attachment to Strong I'm fine if we have to move on. I'm just saying he was brought in to rebuild the program. I know we don't want to hear that but he was. Give him a chance to do that.
 
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I get that people want Herman, but lets slow down a bit. Herman is in the middle of a season in which he may go to the playoffs. He isn't about to accept another job mid season. There is no reason to rush. Second, everyone is freaking out about the Cal loss, but come on. This is a team that is 2-1, the second loss being on the road, and by a TD. No need to write off the season just yet.
Since they day Strong hired Watson I have been a skeptic, but its time to pump the breaks. Let's see how the post loss adjustments work out before we lose our minds.
 
I don't understand the personal attachment to coach A or coach B. I am attached to winning. Win and you are my coach. Lose and you are not. It's all quantitative and not qualitative.

Totally agree.

I'm not on the roster, nor is my son. So I don't have a personal attachment. My rooting interest as an alum is for success for UT. ON and OFF the field. Strong seems like a great guy. That builds character and grows men OFF the field. But the winning ON the field is the other half of that equation.
If a coach isn't doing one OR the other, they have to go.


Time will tell for Strong. Seems to be building something. But his nepotism and loyalty to subpar coordinators is one of the same downfalls Mack had. And Mack was a great guy who also had to go. The D is Charlie's forte....needs to get it fixed.


And D is the easiest thing to fix. An O needs time to install a scheme. D is more read and react. Look how fast our D changed in one week with a firing of Manny Diaz. And hiring an old retread in Greg Robinson who simply focused on basic tackling and simplifying our scheme. He also did a better job of game planning for each opponent instead of stubbornly running the wrong base D for an opponent (like Diaz or see Bedford vs BU when they changed to a wildcat offense and we sat in a 3-3 front with 2 safeties lined up in Mexico as if BUs RB was going to pass it deep). This isn't some shocker. Bedford has been fired before, in our beloved BigXII conference. So was Watson. Both are better position coaches and in over their head as big time conf coordinators.
 
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I don't agree completely. You are right college football is about winning. However you have to have realistic expectations. You can't throw a coach in to a dumpster fire and then say "oh you didn't win? Time to make a change". Your roster dictates how much you win more than anything. Strongsfirst two years hear it was a 5-7 win roster. Coaching is worth one maybe two wins and can make a difference in close games, but your roster dictates what you are.

I'll use Urban Meyer as an example

Ron zook went 8-5 twice and 7-4 before getting the Ax at Flordia. Urban took that roster in his first year went 9-3. Wasn't really that much of an improvement.

So this is no attachment to Strong I'm fine if we have to move on. I'm just saying he was brought in to rebuild the program. I know we don't want to hear that but he was. Give him a chance to do that.

Strong has yet to reach the record that the previous coach was fired with. Urban exceeded the previous coach's record year 1. They aren't on the same arc at all. Strong may be successful here but he's not on the path that other great coaches have traveled.
 
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I agree Horn. Although I think Strong takes to much heat for the Watson hire. It was a bad hire but there is not an OC in this country that was turning Swoops or Hesrd in to anything more than an Avg QB. He brought in a real guy to work with Shane so as far as I'm concerned the Watson deal is in the past
 
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