Is the Heisman award tainted?

[dj701919]

A player winning the National Championship and a Heisman has happened 11 times since 1935. Paul Hornung won a Heisman with a two win season. Winning both is rare and not realistic.

Paul Hornung, QB, Notre Dame, 1956
Hornung got a free pass to the Heisman in ‘56 because he was a quarterback at Notre Dame — even if the Irish went 2-8 that season. He threw for 917 yards and had more than four times as many interceptions (13) as touchdowns (three). Syracuse's Jim Brown, who rushed for more yards (986) and touchdowns (13), finished fifth in that same voting class.

For anyone to pretend that every Heisman winner was the most deserving player is ludicrous.

 

[dj701919]

You mean the same league that OU ran up the score on last year in the playoffs? The SEC defense looked no better than any OU had faced all year, to say anything different is retarded. OU also had more rushing yards in that game than Georgia did so take your crap elsewhere. We all knew going into that game that OU's defense sucked but what we all learned was that Georgia's vaunted SEC defense was a paper tiger

I'll make you a bet. Alabama will soundly beat ou. If I win, you don't post on this sight until the week of the RRS. If you win, I will never post on the ou sight ever again.

 

[Belldozer1]

Also, I wonder if Mayfield would trade his for National Title. I tend to think so. Manziel wouldn't have.

Yes Mayfield is sitting home with his list of woulda, shoulda’s in front of him feeling sorry for himself after getting drafted No. 1 and getting paid. Yes Mayfield is very upset how things worked out. You seem to forget you’re talking about a guy that walked on twice. You think he felt like he deserved anything?
Also, your fellow fans claiming ‘once an Ag always an Ag’ couldn’t be more hilarious.

 

[UT1997]

I assume Riley is the first coach to produce 2 Heismans in first 2 seasons on the job? Number aside, if OU had a better defense and thus fewer close games late in the year, it would've worked against Murray, like Vince in 2005. There was like 51-48 USC wild win over Fresno that sealed it for Bush in '05.

 

[DrinkToIt]

I assume Riley is the first coach to produce 2 Heismans in first 2 seasons on the job? Number aside, if OU had a better defense and thus fewer close games late in the year, it would've worked against Murray, like Vince in 2005. There was like 51-48 USC wild win over Fresno that sealed it for Bush in '05.

OU has also been lucky. Mayfield and Murray are both transfers. Colt and VY very likely could/should have won Heismans as well. They were both certainly deserving.

 

[UT1997]

Uh.... 1st Lt. Roger Staubach of the United States Navy would like a word.

I can't name a single player on the current Army football team. They just went 10-2, and in of those defeats they had OU on the brink in Norman. Was there a star player on Army or do they spread the wealth? Didn't Navy have a guy just a few years that set some kind of rushing TD record?

 

[UT1997]

OU has also been lucky. Mayfield and Murray are both transfers. Colt and VY very likely could/should have won Heismans as well. They were both certainly deserving.

Luck with Heisman voting or with having transfers? I assume voting. I thought Colt in 2008 was more likely than Vince in 2005, but Bradford got it. In 2009, I felt Gerhart should've won, when Ingram was 1st and Colt 2nd.

 

[Belldozer1]

I'll make you a bet. Alabama will soundly beat ou. If I win, you don't post on this sight until the week of the RRS. If you win, I will never post on the ou sight ever again.

I’m not near as impressed with SEC defenses as you. Sure SEC defense against SEC offense looks like a battle for the ages Chucklz. If you watched the Heisman presentation last night and saw the Billy Cannon segment, you saw SEC football in a nutshell. “It was a defense battle for the ages, 3-0 until THE punt return” Just for starters,
Murray’s scrambling will eat Alabama alive. OU pounded Bama in 15’, no one gave us a chance. Up tempo and moving the pocket totally took Bama out of their element. In 17’ again, “OU’s never seen a defense like they’re fixing to play’ Again, OU absolutely rat-a-tat-tatted that SEC defense. Last year, again, “ OU has never faced a defense like they’re fixing to see” Again OU blistered that SEC defense for 48 points. We lost the game but that was all on our crap defense and had nothing whatsoever to do with some kind of superior SEC defense. Once again, this year in the Orange Biwl, OU will put up more than enough points to win, once again can our defense make enough stops to matter. I’m absolutely calling an OU win .

 

[Iitbhorn3]

I’m not near as impressed with SEC defenses as you. Sure SEC defense against SEC offense lols like a battle for the ages Chucklz. Just for starters,
Murray’s scrambling will eat Alabama alive. OU pounded Bama in 15’, no one gave us a chance. Up tempo and moving the pocket totally took Bama out of their element. In 17’ again, “OU’s never seen a defense like they’re fixing to play’ Again, OU absolutely rat-a-tat-tatted that SEC defense. Last year, again, “ OU has never faced a defense like they’re fixing to see” Again OU blistered that SEC defense for 48 points. We lost the game but that was all on our crap defense and had nothing whatsoever to do with some kind of superior SEC defense. Once again, this year in the Orange Biwl, OU will put up more than enough points to win, once again can our defense make enough stops to matter. I’m absolurely calling an OU win .

you will not have your touch-me-not receiver on the field.

 

[LonghornMM]

I’m not near as impressed with SEC defenses as you. Sure SEC defense against SEC offense looks like a battle for the ages Chucklz. If you watched the Heisman presentation last night and saw the Billy Cannon segment, you saw SEC football in a nutshell. “It was a defense battle for the ages, 3-3, until THE punt return” Just for starters,
Murray’s scrambling will eat Alabama alive. OU pounded Bama in 15’, no one gave us a chance. Up tempo and moving the pocket totally took Bama out of their element. In 17’ again, “OU’s never seen a defense like they’re fixing to play’ Again, OU absolutely rat-a-tat-tatted that SEC defense. Last year, again, “ OU has never faced a defense like they’re fixing to see” Again OU blistered that SEC defense for 48 points. We lost the game but that was all on our crap defense and had nothing whatsoever to do with some kind of superior SEC defense. Once again, this year in the Orange Biwl, OU will put up more than enough points to win, once again can our defense make enough stops to matter. I’m absolurely calling an OU win .

I think OU scores 30+ on Bama. Thing is, they're not going to be able to stop Bama though. OU does have a shot to win this game, but if they're going to win, they've got to find some way to slow Alabama's offense down.

 

[Belldozer1]

I think OU scores 30+ on Bama. Thing is, they're not going to be able to stop Bama though. OU does have a shot to win this game, but if they're going to win, they've got to find some way to slow Alabama's offense down.

Couldn’t agree more. I’m just pointing out that the SEC defenses are as susceptible to being defensively violated by OU’s offense as anyone.

 

[dj701919]

I’m not near as impressed with SEC defenses as you. Sure SEC defense against SEC offense looks like a battle for the ages Chucklz. If you watched the Heisman presentation last night and saw the Billy Cannon segment, you saw SEC football in a nutshell. “It was a defense battle for the ages, 3-3, until THE punt return” Just for starters,
Murray’s scrambling will eat Alabama alive. OU pounded Bama in 15’, no one gave us a chance. Up tempo and moving the pocket totally took Bama out of their element. In 17’ again, “OU’s never seen a defense like they’re fixing to play’ Again, OU absolutely rat-a-tat-tatted that SEC defense. Last year, again, “ OU has never faced a defense like they’re fixing to see” Again OU blistered that SEC defense for 48 points. We lost the game but that was all on our crap defense and had nothing whatsoever to do with some kind of superior SEC defense. Once again, this year in the Orange Biwl, OU will put up more than enough points to win, once again can our defense make enough stops to matter. I’m absolurely calling an OU win .

I really can't wrap my head around guys that make comparisons about different teams and different years to validate their arguments. It makes you sound ignorant.

This is not the 2013 ou team or the 2013 Bama team. This isn't 2017 Georgia.

So take the bet then.

 

[clob94]

https://texags.com/forums/5/topics/3007281

Aggys are about 60/40 hating on Kyler but they are 100% convinced he won only because "he wouldn't have survived 12 games playing big boy football in the sec sec sec".

If he scores more than 30 on Bama I'm going to laugh.

 

[Belldozer1]

I really can't wrap my head around guys that make comparisons about different teams and different years to validate their arguments. It makes you sound ignorant.

This is not the 2013 ou team or the 2013 Bama team. This isn't 2017 Georgia.

So take the bet then.

Take your bet to not post if OU loses? No not interested. I’ve been very clear, I’m predicting an OU win, if I’m wrong, I’ll certainly be here to say the other team was the better team that day. As far as your comprehension skills are concerned, that’s an issue I can’t really help you with. Point being, Deej, in Bama game and Georgia game, OU had no chance against those SEC defenses. We beat Bama and lost to Georgia. We put up 45 on Bama and 48 on Georgia. Would you say that allowing OU to score that many points was because of those vaunted SEC defenses you’re infactuated with? You tell me. Sounds like the same song and dance this year. SEC defense is too good for OU, I disagree. You seem to be the only one incapable of wrapping your head around that Deej, nothing new from you.

 

[LonghornMM]

https://texags.com/forums/5/topics/3007281

Aggys are about 60/40 hating on Kyler but they are 100% convinced he won only because "he wouldn't have survived 12 games playing big boy football in the sec sec sec".

If he scores more than 30 on Bama I'm going to laugh.

aggy is a bunch of idiots. "big boy football". They talk like the $EC is some out of this world conference and think that its head and shoulders above anything known to mankind. Its just another conference. And another conference that a&m is an average team in.

 

[dj701919]

Take your bet to not post if OU loses? No not interested. I’ve been very clear, I’m predicting an OU win, if I’m wrong, I’ll certainly be here to say the other team was the better team that day. As far as your comprehension skills are concerned, that’s an issue I can’t really help you with. Point being, Deej, in Bama game and Georgia game, OU had no chance against those SEC defenses. We beat Bama and lost to Georgia. We put up 45 on Bama and 48 on Georgia. Would you say that allowing OU to score that many points was because of those vaunted SEC defenses you’re infactuated with? You tell me. Sounds like the same song and dance this year. SEC defense is too good for OU, I disagree. You seem to be the only one incapable of wrapping your head around that Deej, nothing new from you.

Where did I say SEC defenses are too good for anybody? Where did I say that the SEC was better than everybody?

I'm not in awe of the SEC, but for anyone to suggest that SEC defenses aren't better than Big 12 defenses across the board needs to watch the 2019 NFL draft.

I didn't suggest that ou was going to wear out Alabama because they did 5 years ago.

I watched the "Best OL in college football" struggle with the physicality of Texas. I hate to break it to you, but Alabama is the most physical team in college football. Oklahoma has a reciever with incredible speed, that may not play. If you don't have him to take the top off, Alabama will take away the vertical passing game and make you nickel and dime them down the field. In addition, they will push and collapse the pocket.

Based solely on watching both teams play this season and not based on this one time when a bunch of other guys played well against a bunch of other guys, I see Alabama winning handily.

Then again, I'm not slow.

 

[Belldozer1]

Where did I say SEC defenses are too good for anybody? Where did I say that the SEC was better than everybody?

I'm not in awe of the SEC, but for anyone to suggest that SEC defenses aren't better than Big 12 defenses across the board needs to watch the 2019 NFL draft.

I didn't suggest that ou was going to wear out Alabama because they did 5 years ago.

I watched the "Best OL in college football" struggle with the physicality of Texas. I hate to break it to you, but Alabama is the most physical team in college football. Oklahoma has a reciever with incredible speed, that may not play. If you don't have him to take the top off, Alabama will take away the vertical passing game and make you nickel and dime them down the field. In addition, they will push and collapse the pocket.

Based solely on watching both teams play this season and not based on this one time when a bunch of other guys played well against a bunch of other guys, I see Alabama winning handily.

Then again, I'm not slow.

There’s a reason Saban tried to outlaw the hurry up offense. OU is the master of it. Same song and dance, different year. OU offense will score more than enough to win, can OU’s defense muster a few stops? That’s the only thing keeping OU down.

 

[dj701919]

There’s a reason Saban tried to outlaw the hurry up offense. OU is the master of it. Same song and dance, different year. OU offense will score more than enough to win, can OU’s defense muster a few stops? That’s the only thing keeping OU down.

Like 5 years ago. Alabama has seen plenty of hurry up offenses since then. I feel like the last time you watched Alabama was the 2013 Sugar Bowl.

 

[2300 Nueces]

There’s a reason Saban tried to outlaw the hurry up offense. OU is the master of it. Same song and dance, different year. OU offense will score more than enough to win, can OU’s defense muster a few stops? That’s the only thing keeping OU down.

Ya, Riley looks like a genius. He did learn a lot from Leach, apparently. I really wish Herman and Beck could do something besides what they learned while at Bama and tosu. Our offense is physical but stale. At the moment, Texas relies on talent over superior scheme just like MB of years past, sigh. Anyway, ou needs to field a defense of superior speed and talent that can disrupt play not necessarily massive size. The only problem for ou is that their whole scheme is extremely qb dependant. Is there another midget out there? I don't see it. The guy ou has recruited is in some legal trouble so who knows..... Let's hope he's not hitting women.

 

[RoboCocks21]

Bama pissed Tua didn't win the Heisman bama will be coming for Murray

 

[2300 Nueces]

Bama pissed Tua didn't win the Heisman bama will be coming for Murray

The Bama staff will be over matched. Game prep in the $ec is much more basic than the Big 12. When the Big 12 disintegrates, it will be remembered as the most innovative and trans formative leagues ever to exist. People will sit back in awe and wonder what happened. Murray is going to eviscerate Bama.... Ruffin needs to get creative and get some stops.

 

[dj701919]

The Bama staff will be over matched. Game prep in the $ec is much more basic than the Big 12. When the Big 12 disintegrates, it will be remembered as the most innovative and trans formative leagues ever to exist. People will sit back in awe and wonder what happened? Murray is going to eviscerate Bama.... Ruffin needs to get creative and get some stops.

Do you just make things up? The reason most people believe that Alabama has been able to sustain their success is because of their unparalleled support staff.

https://www.google.com/url?sa=i&sou...aw0JqCfN8JZblwQapBGsM4TH&ust=1544476069331573

 

[2300 Nueces]

Do you just make things up? The reason most people believe that Alabama has been able to sustain their success is because of their unparalleled support staff.

He's scared, otherwise he wouldn't say things like this.

https://www.cbssports.com/college-f...ses-asks-is-this-what-we-want-football-to-be/

Bama has no experience against this type offense. Bama is a known commodity. See, I didn't make anything up. Okie has to disrupt enough to slow down Bama. The okie offense is designed to frustrate and run past ball control offenses. Todd Orlando might be the best coach on our staff. He has done a fine job of slowing down the air raid.

 

[dj701919]

He's scared, otherwise he wouldn't say things like this.

https://www.cbssports.com/college-f...ses-asks-is-this-what-we-want-football-to-be/

Bama has no experience against this type offense. Bama is a known commodity. See, I didn't make anything up. Okie has to disrupt enough to slow down Bama. The okie offense is designed to frustrate and run past ball control offenses. Todd Orlando might be the best coach on our staff. He has done a fine job of slowing down the air raid.

He said he was "not a fan", not "scared of" no huddle offenses. That was in 2012. He has since made adjustments and there have been rule changes.

Yes. Nick Saban, one of the greatest coaches in college football history is scared of a team that barely fields a defense.

 

[2300 Nueces]

He said he was "not a fan", not "scared of" no huddle offenses. That was in 2012. He has since made adjustments and there have been rule changes.

Yes. Nick Saban, one of the greatest coaches in college football history is scared of a team that barely fields a defense.

Not saying he's scared of ou but it does appear he doesn't like change. To me he fears what is changing in CFB. His teams are built by payment and reputation. They are old school. They are plodding teams with great talent. If you study industry, an old technology is always replaced by a disrupting force. This is a classic disruption. The air raid is disrupting CFB and now the NFL. Bama is ripe for upset. I hate ou. I hope our offensive staff is watching.

 

[LonghornMM]

Not saying he's scared of ou but it does appear he doesn't like change. To me he fears what is changing in CFB. His teams are built by payment and reputation. They are old school. They are plodding teams with great talent. If you study industry, an old technology is always replaced by a disrupting force. This is a classic disruption. The air raid is disrupting CFB and now the NFL. Bama is ripe for upset. I hate ou. I hope our offensive staff is watching.

You have to admit though that Bama has adapted offensively. They are no longer a "plodding" offense. They have evolved and have lit up the scoreboard this year.

 

[2300 Nueces]

You have to admit though that Bama has adapted offensively. They are no longer a "plodding" offense. They have evolved and have lit up the scoreboard this year.

Should be a good game.

 

[dj701919]

Not saying he's scared of ou but it does appear he doesn't like change. To me he fears what is changing in CFB. His teams are built by payment and reputation. They are old school. They are plodding teams with great talent. If you study industry, an old technology is always replaced by a disrupting force. This is a classic disruption. The air raid is disrupting CFB and now the NFL. Bama is ripe for upset. I hate ou. I hope our offensive staff is watching.

Yes. Nick Saban, the winner of 5 NCs in the last decade can't adapt to the change of landscape of college football. He will totally outmatched by an offense that has existed for almost 20 years and has never produce a single NCG participant.

In the immortal words of Ric Flair, "To be the man, you have to beat The Man"

 

[DrinkToIt]

Luck with Heisman voting or with having transfers? I assume voting. I thought Colt in 2008 was more likely than Vince in 2005, but Bradford got it. In 2009, I felt Gerhart should've won, when Ingram was 1st and Colt 2nd.

Luck with transfers. Both players are ultimately deserving but they also both fell into OUs lap after having falling outs with the schools they originally went to.

 

[DrinkToIt]

https://texags.com/forums/5/topics/3007281

Aggys are about 60/40 hating on Kyler but they are 100% convinced he won only because "he wouldn't have survived 12 games playing big boy football in the sec sec sec".

If he scores more than 30 on Bama I'm going to laugh.

I'm gonna throw up a little but I will be rooting for OU against Bama. Just to stick it to the aggys.

 

[Mister Moses]

Lucky for OU is right. Think about how smart they were to pick OU. Hardware galore because of their choice.Their former head coaches were both fired on top of that. I think Mordecai will be the man next year. Spencer Rattler will be there, but he won’t start as a freshman.

 

[horn wild]

ou shouldn’t be rewarded for having a terrible defense.
bama 49
worms up north 27

 

[GuaranteedFresh!]

In the immortal words of Ric Flair, "To be the man, you have to beat The Man"

WOOOOOOOOOoooooo!

 

[Iitbhorn3]

is it a mere coincidence that news of Murray's apology for his tweets came only after the heisman ceremony?

 

[LonghornMM]

is it a mere coincidence that news of Murray's apology for his tweets came only after the heisman ceremony?

I can't stand Murray, but the "offended crowd" is continually looking for something to be offended by. Its beyond ridiculous that people are dragging up tweets/comments from years ago about Murray, Kevin Hart, etc.