Kingsbury talks about Manziel

[weevilcatch]

Yeah I still think it will turn out to look just like the Sumlin era, minus a heisman.

Bad timing may hurt him. Texas is set to have a big year, and if we do, he's gonna get smashed by Herman in recruiting. I mean, Herman is killing it with bad teams. Win 9 or 10 and it's over.

I'd be much more worried as a Texas fan about the Jimbo hire if A&M was still in the Big 12. However, they have Saban, Malzahn, Orgeron, Morris, Mullen, Muschamp, and Smart to deal with. While I rate Jimbo higher than some of those names, obviously none of those guys are slouches in X's/O's and recruiting.

That said, for my friend mm42...you mentioned Jimbo being able to turn Texas A&M into an elite program. The only way that will happen is if Jimbo truly buys into Texas A&M and all of their traditions. Sherril did, RC did but nobody has since those two left. And this isn't specific to Texas A&M...any coach at any program has to embrace the history of their program (Mack at Texas, Saban at Bama, Swinney at Clemson, etc.).

Jimbo will have to buy into everything. He will have to fully embrace everything about Texas A&M from the corps, to the yell leaders, to the midnight yell, etc. Does he have that energy?

I think a legitimate question to ask is...did Jimbo come to A&M because of the money, or did he come because he loves the school and is going to put the energy into building it into an elite program.

 

[mm42]

Top coaches in no particular order.

Saban
Smart
Pederson
Meyer
Swinney


Not sure how Kirby Smart seems to be forgotten in this thread.

Herman is top 10, likely moving up soon.

I'll agree on Pederson, but Smart needs a few years. He is odds on favorite to be the next top guy, but he needs a couple years. I am 90% sure he will be on everyone's top 5 list in 2 years, maybe even #1.

How is Herman top 10? I am not slamming Herman, but top 10 in the country???? He is probably 5th in his own 10 team conference. Patterson, Snyder, Gundy, Riley, Herman. Herman appears to be a good young coach, but he really hasn't won/done anything yet. I am interested to see how he and Riley Lincoln compare over time, they are both young and at schools with resources.

 

[mm42]

I'd be much more worried as a Texas fan about the Jimbo hire if A&M was still in the Big 12. However, they have Saban, Malzahn, Orgeron, Morris, Mullen, Muschamp, and Smart to deal with. While I rate Jimbo higher than some of those names, obviously none of those guys are slouches in X's/O's and recruiting.

That said, for my friend mm42...you mentioned Jimbo being able to turn Texas A&M into an elite program. The only way that will happen is if Jimbo truly buys into Texas A&M and all of their traditions. Sherril did, RC did but nobody has since those two left. And this isn't specific to Texas A&M...any coach at any program has to embrace the history of their program (Mack at Texas, Saban at Bama, Swinney at Clemson, etc.).

Jimbo will have to buy into everything. He will have to fully embrace everything about Texas A&M from the corps, to the yell leaders, to the midnight yell, etc. Does he have that energy?

I think a legitimate question to ask is...did Jimbo come to A&M because of the money, or did he come because he loves the school and is going to put the energy into building it into an elite program.

What grade are you in? These top guys are mercenaries. He came to A&M because we have money to pay him, give him an unlimited budget for assistants, extra staff etc... And he thought he could win. He doesn't have to love the Corp or midnight yell, or anything else. Jimbo loves Jimbo and winning football games. Which is fine.

 

[Metcalf #2]

Simple. How many coaches could turn Houston into a true national player like Herman did? Pretty much the guys I listed, plus maybe a few more. That's it.

Your mistake is judging on current records only. Is Smart going to suddenly become a better coach in two years, or will it simply be proven he is a great coach? Same for Herman. You can't rank coaches the way you do teams.

Darrell Royal struggled early at Texas. Did he suddenly become better, or did it just take time for his genius to be proven.

I could go on and on.

 

[mm42]

Simple. How many coaches could turn Houston into a true national player like Herman did? Pretty much the guys I listed, plus maybe a few more. That's it.

Your mistake is judging on current records only. Is Smart going to suddenly become a better coach in two years, or will it simply be proven he is a great coach? Same for Herman. You can't rank coaches the way you do teams.

Darrell Royal struggled early at Texas. Did he suddenly become better, or did it just take time for his genius to be proven.

I could go on and on.

Houston is not a true national player and wasn't when Herman was their. They are a really good mid major with a history of launching coaches to big P5 jobs. Art Briles, Kevin Sumlin etc.... Briles really got Houston going, that POS was such an awesome coach and program builder.

 

[Metcalf #2]

Top 5 ranking, BCS bowls, that's not a national player. Ok you're done.

 

[weevilcatch]

What grade are you in? These top guys are mercenaries. He came to A&M because we have money to pay him, give him an unlimited budget for assistants, extra staff etc... And he thought he could win. He doesn't have to love the Corp or midnight yell, or anything else. Jimbo loves Jimbo and winning football games. Which is fine.

Well fella, I'm 39 years old. I have been a HC in multiple sports at the HS and college level. If you think putting in energy to consume yourself in every tiny aspect of what makes each college unique is not necessary then you have your answer as to why your school is always second fiddle.

"Wanting" to win is not enough. Who in the hell doesn't "want" to win? lol. Like one of my college coaches told me once (he actually coached at A&M for a time)..."Everything counts to someone" Meaning, you may think it is minuscule and trivial, but understand it means something to someone.

Direct quote from Jackie Sherrill

"The infrastructure is only part of it. There are many things it takes to win a championship. If you have all of them aligned, then it’s easy to win a championship. If you don’t have them then you look around the country at championship-winning schools and realize they have the administration, the faculty, the student body, the former students, the coaches, and they have the media all going in the right direction."

Loving yourself and money and just "wanting" to win will get Jimbo and the Aggie fan base a whole bunch more of 8-5.

 

[q1w2e3]

Just wondering who you think the top coaches are, not named Saban, Meyers, or Swinney? Let me guess: Gundy, Patterson and Herman.

Any list of coaches right now would consider Jimbo a top coach, but like I said I haven't been as impressed and it has nothing to do with A&M. He's a proven do less with more coach, and I wonder how much of his success is just being in the right place at the right time. There are probably several other coaches who would have done as good or better in his same shoes.

As far as your guess on Gundy, Patterson, and Herman.....let's ask a somewhat neutral third party. I googled top coach list for this year and took the first one I saw, which is a CBS sports writer list. It's a list of average rank of all 65 Power Five coaches among a group CBS sports' college writers such as Tom Fornelli, Jerry Palm, Barton Simmons...etc....Definitely not anywhere near an exact science but averages out a consensus of numerous minds whose job is to cover college football. So..

-as anyone with a brain should expect, both Gary Patterson (#6) and Gundy (#11) were considered top coaches

-Herman at #28, which was the same ranking this same list had him for 2017. So after his inaugural year at Texas he held even.

-Fisher was at #4, which is no surprise. He will land inside the top 10 on just about anyone's list b/c of 2013 and Jameis Winston

-my thoughts on the SEC coaching landscape were reflected as I expected in this list:

-five of the 14 SEC coaches fell in the bottom ten of all 65 coaches. That would be 36% of the conference's coaches are bottom of the barrel right now.

-a step even further, seven of the SEC's 14 coaches were ranked 50th or worse. That means a full half of the SEC coaches fall in the bottom 20%

-by comparison, only one Big 12 coach fell in the bottom ten or even ranked 50th or worse: David Beaty @ Kansas

-On the front side of the rankings: The SEC had 5/14 coaches ranked in the top 15, or 36% of SEC coaches. The Big 12 had 4/10 coaches in the top 15, or 40%.

Link: https://www.cbssports.com/college-f...ge-football-coaches-entering-the-2018-season/

 

[mm42]

Well fella, I'm 39 years old. I have been a HC in multiple sports at the HS and college level. If you think putting in energy to consume yourself in every tiny aspect of what makes each college unique is not necessary then you have your answer as to why your school is always second fiddle.

"Wanting" to win is not enough. Who in the hell doesn't "want" to win? lol. Like one of my college coaches told me once (he actually coached at A&M for a time)..."Everything counts to someone" Meaning, you may think it is minuscule and trivial, but understand it means something to someone.

Direct quote from Jackie Sherrill

"The infrastructure is only part of it. There are many things it takes to win a championship. If you have all of them aligned, then it’s easy to win a championship. If you don’t have them then you look around the country at championship-winning schools and realize they have the administration, the faculty, the student body, the former students, the coaches, and they have the media all going in the right direction."

Loving yourself and money and just "wanting" to win will get Jimbo and the Aggie fan base a whole bunch more of 8-5.

I think you are 100% correct if we were discussing the high school level. Or even small college or a non-revenue sport at a major university. Only a few hundred people really give a shit. It is not the same as running a $150M+ a year business. He is being paid handsomely to form the culture of his program, to lead it not follow.

These guys are professionals, they don't teach history or math half the day. They spend 80+ hours a week on football and football related crap.

If Jimbo knows every yell, becomes a fish camp instructor, and loves aggieland with all his heart, he will still get fired if his team sucks. If he is a good Aggie and we suck for years, I'll help pack his shit. If he is a total prick and we win, I will love the guy.

 

[clob94]

What do you mean you're not interested in watching the Thursday night football game between Tulane and East Carolina?

Signed,

The Middle of July

 

[weevilcatch]

I think you are 100% correct if we were discussing the high school level. Or even small college or a non-revenue sport at a major university. Only a few hundred people really give a shit. It is not the same as running a $150M+ a year business. He is being paid handsomely to form the culture of his program, to lead it not follow.

These guys are professionals, they don't teach history or math half the day. They spend 80+ hours a week on football and football related crap.

If Jimbo knows every yell, becomes a fish camp instructor, and loves aggieland with all his heart, he will still get fired if his team sucks. If he is a good Aggie and we suck for years, I'll help pack his shit. If he is a total prick and we win, I will love the guy.

What I'm telling you is not that he has to be leading midnight yell. What I'm saying is he needs to understand it. I'm obviously not saying he needs to become a fish camp instructor, but he needs to understand it.

It is the "all in" mentality. "Row the boat" mentality. "Doing all the little things" mentality.

I'm not sure why you think building an elite program will be just Jimbo and his staff going to practice and watching film. It is SO MUCH more than that.


Does anyone remember the two things Mack did when he got to Texas? Or what Mack told Herman to do?

You may think things like Howard's Rock, and Orange pants at Clemson are trivial but Dabo Swinney would disagree with you.

I could go on, but I feel I would be wasting my time....

 

[outhereincali]

Top coaches in no particular order.

Saban
Smart
Pederson
Meyer
Swinney


Not sure how Kirby Smart seems to be forgotten in this thread.

Herman is top 10, likely moving up soon.

Hey Metcalf isn't Pedersen an NFL coach

As to who is on my top ten coaches list. First of all Saban, Dabo, and Urban are on the list no questions asked. I think Smart needs a few more seasons like last year before he should be in the top ten.

But let me tell you who should be the 4th coach on this list I'm talking about Chris Petersen at WA. He's shown me that what he did at Boise was no fluke he's more than capable of taking a P5 schedule and taking them to a championship like I think they can this year.

If you're not noticing Chris Petersen you better start doing so.

And if you still don't think Chris Petersen isn't a top ten coach just ask Bob Stoops.

 

[Metcalf #2]

I was talking about Chris Peterson, sorry. No explanation why I got the names confused, because I don't have one. Lol

 

[Metcalf #2]

Oh and btw, sorry I don't need to wait two years to put Smart in the top 5. I think we all knew what he was gonna do when he got a head coaching job, and he's already proven us right. It's not like he just came outta nowhere and shocked us all.

 

[outhereincali]

I was talking about Chris Peterson, sorry. No explanation why I got the names confused, because I don't have one. Lol

Well that makes sense : ) And when I think of Chris Petersen I always think of Oklahoma and the statue of liberty I will lol forever : l

 

[outhereincali]

Oh and btw, sorry I don't need to wait two years to put Smart in the top 5. I think we all knew what he was gonna do when he got a head coaching job, and he's already proven us right. It's not like he just came outta nowhere and shocked us all.

Well when you put it that way maybe i should reconsider Kirby Smart.

 

[outhereincali]

Oh and btw, sorry I don't need to wait two years to put Smart in the top 5. I think we all knew what he was gonna do when he got a head coaching job, and he's already proven us right. It's not like he just came outta nowhere and shocked us all.

Well we have 5 coaches who deserve consideration in the top ten. And let me name number 6. David Shaw at ST. Bryce Love is the preseason favorite for the Heisman. DS is an outstanding coach and imho, ST has a real chance of being in a P6 bowl game this year.

 

[Metcalf #2]

Damn, forgot about Shaw. He has to in the top 5 somewhere. Maybe I'll drop Swinney in favor of Shaw. Just because I can't stand Dabo the wonder douche.

 

[mm42]

Oh and btw, sorry I don't need to wait two years to put Smart in the top 5. I think we all knew what he was gonna do when he got a head coaching job, and he's already proven us right. It's not like he just came outta nowhere and shocked us all.

I am pretty sure you are right, I actually think Kirby Smart will likely overtake Saban in 3 years but....,
There are a lot of one year wonders. After year 1 Kevin Sumlin had USC pushing hard for him and A&M signed him to a huge guaranteed contract.
Charlie Weis turned Notre Dame back to a national power (we thought), got an incredible extension and may still be getting a check today.
Remember Brady Hoke, Gene Chizik, Layne Kiffin and probably many more. Lot's of sure things weren't.

 

[SwagCopter]

"top coach" who had embarrassing and/or blowout losses year in year out like clockwork, despite having top 5 talent. And he's not recruiting at Florida State anymore.

The one thing he may have going for him is the SEC has significantly fallen off with top coaching. Where are the elite coaches in the SEC now? Outside of Saban, who is going to hang it up any year now, there is a whole lotta question marks. The SEC West has Saban and then a vast land of mediocre or complete question marks, in addition to maybe the worst coach in all of 1A.