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Ranking the $EC jobs

"You can judge hoe valuable a job is by who takes it when it becomes available."

That argument would hold some water if coaching decisions were made in a Vacuum.

Alabama is in the middle of a dynasty era. They have won or been in the mix for NC for nearly half a decade. Saban would be crazy to leave Alabama right now, but it was said many times that if he ever did leave, it would be for Texas.

Harbaugh was still the coach of the 49ers when Texas was doing their search. He has now publicly said that it was not his decision to leave the 49ers. Furthermore Michigan is his alma mater.

Myer was waiting for the Ohio State job to open. Again, he is from the area. He wanted to go back there. Thats not a knock on the attractiveness of Texas for head coaches.

The only real argument here for a coach that "turned down" Texas would be Briles. Who knows what really happened behind closed doors, but the prevailing record of events is that he was ready to take the job, but Patterson insisted that he interview for the job. Again, it would be career suicide for Briles to interview for the Texas job if in fact he did not get it and had to go back, tail between his legs, to Baylor. IMO this was a huge fck up by the people in charge of the Texas coaching search, and frankly, insulting to Briles.

On to Strong. I think most people believed when Strong was hired that it was with the caveat that he make a strong hire at OC, and in fact was handed a blank check to do so. If he had done so people would be singing a completely different tune about Strong. Instead he hired Watson, supposedly against the wishes of Patterson, and now he is on a short leash.

That brings me to Sumlin. Even though Aggies have anointed him as some kind of genius coach and recruiter, the guy actually hasn't accomplished much of anything. He put up some big offensive numbers at U of H, but he was seen as an up and comer type of hire, not a hire for a destination program. And lets not rewrite history, a lot of Aggies were pissed about it, and some in fact had hoped for Strong.
 
IMO, the Sumlin and Strong hires were extremely comparable.

Sumlin spent a lot of time at a successul program as the OC at OU much the same way Strong did at UF as the DC. They are obviously well skilled on different sides of the ball.

Strong did a great job at Louisville in a very weak conference. I would agree that what he did was more impressive than Sumlin at UH but Sumlin did have a 10+ win team that was in the top 10 when he left.

I would not trade Sumlin for Strong and I know your fanbase wouldnt trade Strong for Sumlin.

I think both are very good coaches and it remains to be seen whether either can build a team that can win it all.
 
All I'm saying is that you can't judge the desirability of a program based on who took the job, because there are many more factors at play. I think most people would view Strong as a great hire had he gone out and gotten a splash hire type OC, but he did not.
 
Texas SHOULD be #1 but is not. This is mainly because of the internal forces and politics within the school itself. This was well-publicized during your coaching search. I know everyone blames Mack, but there were other things working against the success of your program. Also, as much as head coaches in general are paid (ie Baylor, SMU) it is not hard to understand why some coaches would choose to stay somewhere and become a legend at that school vs taking a job with the immediate pressure and headaches of a school like Texas. You will win again because you have too much going for you, but I think gone are the days when ANYBODY can just get who they want because of their reputation. Also, how many "can't miss" coaching hires are there? I think there is Saban and Meyer...period. Briles is close I think.
 
I know everyone blames Mack, but there were other things working against the success of your program

Just stop it, Mack got lazy and his ego got in the way of hiring a new coach at the right time. Every school has political figures who get in the way. Mack staying on 3 years to late is what caused this road bump for Texas.

Texas is still the best coaching job in America, hell Saban went 6-7 his first year at Alabama and that dumpster fire.
This post was edited on 2/26 11:40 AM by Falko
 
Originally posted by AnimalMother:

IMO, the Sumlin and Strong hires were extremely comparable.

Sumlin spent a lot of time at a successul program as the OC at OU much the same way Strong did at UF as the DC. They are obviously well skilled on different sides of the ball.

Strong did a great job at Louisville in a very weak conference. I would agree that what he did was more impressive than Sumlin at UH but Sumlin did have a 10+ win team that was in the top 10 when he left.

I would not trade Sumlin for Strong and I know your fanbase wouldnt trade Strong for Sumlin.

I think both are very good coaches and it remains to be seen whether either can build a team that can win it all.
Let's take a closer look at the trophy cases:

Charlie Strong

As a DC: 2 NCs
As a HC: 2 Conference Championships, 1 BCS Bowl Victory, 1 Sugar Bowl Throphy

Kevin Sumlin

As an OC: Cobwebs
As a HC: Cobwebs

Congrats on being the SEC's version of Texas Tech.
 
Yes, I agree with you, but Texas' political issues are bigger than most.
 
Originally posted by AnimalMother:

IMO, the Sumlin and Strong hires were extremely comparable.

Sumlin spent a lot of time at a successul program as the OC at OU much the same way Strong did at UF as the DC. They are obviously well skilled on different sides of the ball.

Strong did a great job at Louisville in a very weak conference. I would agree that what he did was more impressive than Sumlin at UH but Sumlin did have a 10+ win team that was in the top 10 when he left.

I would not trade Sumlin for Strong and I know your fanbase wouldnt trade Strong for Sumlin.

I think both are very good coaches and it remains to be seen whether either can build a team that can win it all.

Why would we trade Strong - who actually has accomplished things as a DC and as a coach - for sumlin who has won NOTHING as anything... you have to be stupid, not to mention ignorant of both coaches to think that sumlins career is even comparable to Strong at this point... why would we trade down for inspector gadget who doesn't seem to be able to win anything anywere he goes... even when he was in one of those "weak conferences"... didn't see Sumlin wining anything at Houston... in a weak conference... and we have seen sumlins teams regress each and every year like clockwork.... only a fool would trade from Strong, down to sumlin.
 
No one cares though what Strong accomplished as a DC or what he did with an inferior conference. His current resume as a Texas coach isn't very good. You guys will turn drastically against him THIS year if you don't start seeing improvements. This is Sumlin's year. It has to be now for anyone to give him credibility. If the team sucks this year then I am sold Sumlin can't get it done.
 
Strong is going to live or die by Sean Watson. I can't remember who said it, but some famous coach said the best attribute of a head coach is knowing his weaknesses. I'm not sure that Strong does.

He had an opportunity to bring in a great offensive mind and compliment his defensive prowess. Instead he brought in an average, at best, OC, whose main upside seems to be that he agrees with Strong's overall philosophy and who won't put the defense in jeopardy with bad field position, unnecessary risks, or quick outs. The only problem is, the offense was SO bad, that it did in fact put the defense in jeopardy by leaving them on the field for 40 minutes a game.

Patterson at TCU figured out after one year on the job that Tressel ball wasn't going to cut it in the Big 12. Strong seems to have realized that his talent does not fit his scheme, but he's sticking with the same play caller. Its a huge gamble IMO and one that might cost him his job. If I "turn" on Strong this year, it will be because he failed to realize the need to have an innovative and creative play caller to assist him.
 
Originally posted by Black_SoxAg:

No one cares though what Strong accomplished as a DC or what he did with an inferior conference. His current resume as a Texas coach isn't very good. You guys will turn drastically against him THIS year if you don't start seeing improvements. This is Sumlin's year. It has to be now for anyone to give him credibility. If the team sucks this year then I am sold Sumlin can't get it done.
Sumlin hasn't won anything ANYWHERE.... and has gotten worse year after year after year with aggy.... it has been "sumlins year" for quite some time now in b/cs, and each year he posts a worse record than the year before.

So why would anyone trade Strong - a proven winner through his career, with sumlin who hasn't won anything - even in an inferior conference.... and fwiw - in case you forgot, in that inferior conference, he went to a BCS bowl and beat Florida.... when was the last time sumlin took a team to a BCS bowl or won one as a HC?

And just for fun... beating Florida in a BCS bowl is impressive seeing as how the sec would only have had 2 teams at most in the BCS which means Florida was one of the 2 best teams in your "superior" conference..... not bad for coaching in an inferior conference.. and of course aggys don't want to talk about that b/c sumlin couldn't win anything at Houston as a HC either....

Sumlin has been at aggy for close to 4 years now? he should have already been showing promise and improvement, yet he regresses EVERY year... try to explain that away while I Iaugh at you for trying.
 
Originally posted by AnimalMother:

IMO, the Sumlin and Strong hires were extremely comparable.

Sumlin spent a lot of time at a successul program as the OC at OU much the same way Strong did at UF as the DC. They are obviously well skilled on different sides of the ball.

Strong did a great job at Louisville in a very weak conference. I would agree that what he did was more impressive than Sumlin at UH but Sumlin did have a 10+ win team that was in the top 10 when he left.

I would not trade Sumlin for Strong and I know your fanbase wouldnt trade Strong for Sumlin.

I think both are very good coaches and it remains to be seen whether either can build a team that can win it all.









Why would we trade Strong - who actually has accomplished things as a DC and as a coach - for sumlin who has won NOTHING as anything... you have to be stupid, not to mention ignorant of both coaches to think that sumlins career is even comparable to Strong at this point... why would we trade down for inspector gadget who doesn't seem to be able to win anything anywere he goes... even when he was in one of those "weak conferences"... didn't see Sumlin wining anything at Houston... in a weak conference... and we have seen sumlins teams regress each and every year like clockwork.... only a fool would trade from Strong, down to sumlin.


Wow that was predictable. Most any observer around the country isnt going too see much, if any, difference between Sumlin and Strong and it has nothing to do with race. I personally would not trade Sumlin for Strong and I doubt any non biased fan would either.


BTW, Sumlin has won coach of the year 3x in 7 years as a head coach. They dont hand out those awards to coaches who suck as bad as you think he does.

This post was edited on 2/26 12:13 PM by AnimalMother
 
"I personally would not trade Sumlin for Strong and I doubt any non biased fan would either."

Funny you should say that, because most analysts and other coaches say exactly the opposite. They all think Strong is a fantastic coach that will get things turned around in Austin, but are concerned that fans are going to lose patience before he has had the chance. At A&M though, it the opposite. A coach with a tremendous amount of fan support that hasn't really accomplished much, even though he inherited a lot of talent.

But thats kind of A&M in a nut shell, isn't it. A fan base who can't see the product in front of them for what it is.
 
Originally posted by AnimalMother:
Originally posted by AnimalMother:

IMO, the Sumlin and Strong hires were extremely comparable.

Sumlin spent a lot of time at a successul program as the OC at OU much the same way Strong did at UF as the DC. They are obviously well skilled on different sides of the ball.

Strong did a great job at Louisville in a very weak conference. I would agree that what he did was more impressive than Sumlin at UH but Sumlin did have a 10+ win team that was in the top 10 when he left.

I would not trade Sumlin for Strong and I know your fanbase wouldnt trade Strong for Sumlin.

I think both are very good coaches and it remains to be seen whether either can build a team that can win it all.









Why would we trade Strong - who actually has accomplished things as a DC and as a coach - for sumlin who has won NOTHING as anything... you have to be stupid, not to mention ignorant of both coaches to think that sumlins career is even comparable to Strong at this point... why would we trade down for inspector gadget who doesn't seem to be able to win anything anywere he goes... even when he was in one of those "weak conferences"... didn't see Sumlin wining anything at Houston... in a weak conference... and we have seen sumlins teams regress each and every year like clockwork.... only a fool would trade from Strong, down to sumlin.


Wow that was predictable. Most any observer around the country isnt going too see much, if any, difference between Sumlin and Strong and it has nothing to do with race. I personally would not trade Sumlin for Strong and I doubt any non biased fan would either.


BTW, Sumlin has won coach of the year 3x in 7 years as a head coach. They dont hand out those awards to coaches who suck as bad as you think he does.


This post was edited on 2/26 12:13 PM by AnimalMother
That is the truth, which is probably why you felt it was predictable... but aggy logic is backwards....

and coach of the year? in what conference? was this while he was coaching at Houston b/c he has never won national coach of the year..... and he has NEVER won coach of the year in the SEC either.....

http://www.sports-reference.com/cfb/awards/sec-coy.html

So he won Coach of the year at Houston.. yet yall don't want to give Strong credit for winning all the he has at UofL..... funny... probably b/c Strong actually has the hardware to show for what he did with his teams on a relevant national stage.... won a couple CC's, and a BCS bowl while sumlin won coach of the year for 3 years while he was at Houston...... EVERY conference has a coach of the year award.. and a coach of the year award at Houston isn't anything to brag about.... so yeah, they kinda do give those awards to coaches that suck like sumlin... but do explain to me what he has won or done since leaving Houston n terms of championships, wins or the BCS that makes him better or even on par with what Strongs teams accomplished on the field.... tell me all about the hardware his teams have won....

And lets be real, while Houston and UofL aren't in major conferences, the one Strong was in was much better than the one sumlin was coaching in either way.... and of course you wouldn't trade coaches with us - aggy life is mired in mediocrity and failure... sumlin fits right in for that and shows it a little more each year in b/cs.... yall wouldn't change coaches b/c you like seeing your program run in to the ground and then paying a coach who no longer works for you for multiple years while allowing another coach to start the cycle over again..........

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_%22Bear%22_Bryant_Award
 
I dont think that facts are really going to mean much to you at this point but Sumlin did win SEC coach of the year in 2012.
 
Didn't they finish in 5th place that year? I'll chalk that up to the SEC being so full of SEC that they just couldn't imagine a new coach taking a team from the big 12 all the way to 3rd in his division.

Either way fan support and media awards does not a winner make. In the SEC or anywhere else.

This post was edited on 2/26 2:32 PM by horn01
 
Originally posted by AnimalMother:
You can judge hoe valuable a job is by who takes it when it becomes available.

Alabama
Sabah

Ohio state
Meyer

Michigan
Harbaugh

Texas???? Strong
Saban was blowing it in the NFL, Meyer is an Ohio boy and Harbaugh is a Michigan man..... Wherever you were trying to go with this is not reality!


As for Strong, the World Wide Leader says he has the best job in college football. Go fix their perception of reality!

This post was edited on 2/26 2:36 PM by TexExSpur
 
Originally posted by AnimalMother:

I dont think that facts are really going to mean much to you at this point but Sumlin did win SEC coach of the year in 2012.

You are correct, he did.. I missed that.. but it doesn't change anything else that was said.... he won the others at Houston... in an "inferior conference" while Strong won 2 CC's and a BCS bowl....... and JM won sumlin that COY award......since that award he has progressively gotten worse and worse.... but yeah you wouldn't change coaches b/c you like to watch your team regress each and every year..... I know those FACTS don't mean much to you either.. logic and reasoning seldom do when it comes to agys..
 
Originally posted by LonghornSoldier:


Originally posted by AnimalMother:

I dont think that facts are really going to mean much to you at this point but Sumlin did win SEC coach of the year in 2012.

You are correct, he did.. I missed that.. but it doesn't change anything else that was said.... he won the others at Houston... in an "inferior conference" while Strong won 2 CC's and a BCS bowl....... and JM won sumlin that COY award......since that award he has progressively gotten worse and worse.... but yeah you wouldn't change coaches b/c you like to watch your team regress each and every year..... I know those FACTS don't mean much to you either.. logic and reasoning seldom do when it comes to agys..
And just for fun.. did you know that Spurrier and Nutt both won COY in the sec with 7-5 records, and croom won it with an 8-5 record....... when there were obviously better teams in the sec in those years?
This post was edited on 2/26 2:54 PM by LonghornSoldier
 
This is Sumlin's year.
laugh.r191677.gif


So you are preaching that Texas fans should boot Strong after his second year if improvements are not made? Remind me again but Sumlin is in his 5th year and hasn't won shit but a Cotton Bowl with a Heisman winner and 2 other first rounders?

Also you say give zero credit for Charlie winning his BCS Sugar Bowl because of the conference he was in? He dismantled a Florida team who raped Manzeil in CS and did very well in the SEC that year.
 
Falko. Sumlin is in his 5th year? I must have missed some games.
 
I find it interesting that Hugh Freeze is at the 10th rated school in the SEC according to this list, and turned down Florida (#1]. Makes you wonder how big the gap is between the top 10 SEC schools. Quality depth.
 
You guys are hilarious in your criticism of Sumlin. He's won 70% of his games and has a 4-1 bowl record. I doubt you would be judging a coach that harshly if he didn't coach tamu.

I know you all think Mack brown is trash now but it wasn't that long ago most were defending and supporting him before he "won" anything of significance. Remember brown didn't win a conf title until year 22.
 
" He's won 70% of his games and has a 4-1 bowl record. I doubt you would be judging a coach that harshly if he didn't coach tamu."

Somehow that impresses you.

1-Of course he's won 70 percent of his games, he had 4 years coaching in conference USA.
laugh.r191677.gif


2-Congrats on his 4 bowl wins over Army, West Virginia, OU and Duke. West Virginia and Army weren't ranked at the end of the year. OU and Duke were barely ranked at the end of they year. So congrats to Sumlin for beating 4 average teams in a bowl game.
 
Lets not get crazy and compare Mack and Sumlin. Mack won at least ten games for 10 years, and was in the top two of the conference annually. His teams were a fixture in BCS bowls. Sumlin's best finish in the SEC was 3rd in his division.
 
Originally posted by Black_SoxAg:

No one cares though what Strong accomplished as a DC or what he did with an inferior conference.

More ridiculous aggy dishonesty. You guys wouldn't EVER shut up if your coach had the skins on the wall at his previous stops the way Strong does. As it stands, your overpaid coach hasn't won jack squat ANYWHERE so you pretend it doesn't matter. We see you though.
laugh.r191677.gif


His current resume as a Texas coach isn't very good.

After 1 year? OK. You guys sure seem to like your do nothing DJ after 3 years of NOTHING.
 
Originally posted by AnimalMother:

I dont think that facts are really going to mean much to you at this point but Sumlin did win SEC coach of the year in 2012.
When does the national championship go up on your stadium wall?
 
" He's won 70% of his games and has a 4-1 bowl record. I doubt you would be judging a coach that harshly if he didn't coach tamu."

Somehow that impresses you.



Well genius most of the better coaches out there have a winning % in the 65-75% range so yes it impresses me.
 
A) No titles of any kind anywhere he's been

and

B) That's only because of ultra-weak aggy OOC scheduling against the sisters of the poor and blind


This post was edited on 2/27 11:17 AM by Scholz
 
Originally posted by AnimalMother:
" He's won 70% of his games and has a 4-1 bowl record. I doubt you would be judging a coach that harshly if he didn't coach tamu."

Somehow that impresses you.



Well genius most of the better coaches out there have a winning % in the 65-75% range so yes it impresses me.
Sumlin's record at ATM is 28-11, .718 winning percentage.

Included in that record are 12 nonconference wins vs.: SMU three times, Sam Houston twice, Rice twice, Lamar, UTEP, South Carolina STATE, ULM and La.Tech.

That leaves a conference record of 13-11 = .542 winning percentage. Looks like Sumlin is a little bit above average for ATM standards.
 
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