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Time for UT to make a power play for Herman..

I don't see how a 3 win improvement(at least) off of last year is "status quo". Now if he goes 5-7, 6-6 and keeps his job THEN you can say status quo.
By status quo I mean a mediocre record for our talent base and resources, bad coaching hires and decision making and the constant firing of assistants until they find the right ones, and dropping games to much less talented teams by being out coached. It all starts at the top...
 
I don't agree completely. You are right college football is about winning. However you have to have realistic expectations. You can't throw a coach in to a dumpster fire and then say "oh you didn't win? Time to make a change". Your roster dictates how much you win more than anything. Strongsfirst two years hear it was a 5-7 win roster. Coaching is worth one maybe two wins and can make a difference in close games, but your roster dictates what you are.

I'll use Urban Meyer as an example

Ron zook went 8-5 twice and 7-4 before getting the Ax at Flordia. Urban took that roster in his first year went 9-3. Wasn't really that much of an improvement.

So this is no attachment to Strong I'm fine if we have to move on. I'm just saying he was brought in to rebuild the program. I know we don't want to hear that but he was. Give him a chance to do that.


We AREN'T in year 1. And Strong is NOT Urban Meyer.


I do believe stability is huge. You can't keep firing people and bringing in new staff and trying to run the wrong styles for the wrong players you have on the roster from the last coach. You'll always be behind the 8 ball, see Aggie or the Cleveland Browns etc. But Zook was a mediocre coach. Who was never going to do better than what he was doing. Meyer was a next level coach. And he proved it. Time and time again. I don't think the book is closed on Strong.....but he needs to fix his D. It is his forte. Get it done. There is talent on the team. We ignored how bad the D was because the O was just as bad. But see what a difference a coach can make (I'm looking at you Sterlin).
 
I get that people want Herman, but lets slow down a bit. Herman is in the middle of a season in which he may go to the playoffs. He isn't about to accept another job mid season. There is no reason to rush. Second, everyone is freaking out about the Cal loss, but come on. This is a team that is 2-1, the second loss being on the road, and by a TD. No need to write off the season just yet.
Since they day Strong hired Watson I have been a skeptic, but its time to pump the breaks. Let's see how the post loss adjustments work out before we lose our minds.
I think Cal dropping 50 on us like a high school game is freaking unacceptable.
 
Strong has yet to reach the record that the previous coach was fired with. Urban exceeded the previous coach's record year 1. They aren't on the same arc at all. Strong may be successful here but he's not on the path that other great coaches have traveled.
You missed the point. I'm not arguing the same arc. I'm saying when the previous coach leaves you a 7-8 win roster. It's not hard to win 9 games. When you inherited a roster that's struggling to get to bowl games and you don't have a QB. Yeah you might struggle.
 
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We AREN'T in year 1. And Strong is NOT Urban Meyer.


I do believe stability is huge. You can't keep firing people and bringing in new staff and trying to run the wrong styles for the wrong players you have on the roster from the last coach. You'll always be behind the 8 ball, see Aggie or the Cleveland Browns etc. But Zook was a mediocre coach. Who was never going to do better than what he was doing. Meyer was a next level coach. And he proved it. Time and time again. I don't think the book is closed on Strong.....but he needs to fix his D. It is his forte. Get it done. There is talent on the team. We ignored how bad the D was because the O was just as bad. But see what a difference a coach can make (I'm looking at you Sterlin).
Missed the point
 
I don't understand the personal attachment to coach A or coach B. I am attached to winning. Win and you are my coach. Lose and you are not. It's all quantitative and not qualitative.
Agree. Unfortunately, Stoops has built up a few mulligans and has a long leash. At least UT is in a position where they can cut bait if need be.
 
Totally agree.

I'm not on the roster, nor is my son. So I don't have a personal attachment. My rooting interest as an alum is for success for UT. ON and OFF the field. Strong seems like a great guy. That builds character and grows men OFF the field. But the winning ON the field is the other half of that equation.
If a coach isn't doing one OR the other, they have to go.


Time will tell for Strong. Seems to be building something. But his nepotism and loyalty to subpar coordinators is one of the same downfalls Mack had. And Mack was a great guy who also had to go. The D is Charlie's forte....needs to get it fixed.


And D is the easiest thing to fix. An O needs time to install a scheme. D is more read and react. Look how fast our D changed in one week with a firing of Manny Diaz. And hiring an old retread in Greg Robinson who simply focused on basic tackling and simplifying our scheme. He also did a better job of game planning for each opponent instead of stubbornly running the wrong base D for an opponent (like Diaz or see Bedford vs BU when they changed to a wildcat offense and we sat in a 3-3 front with 2 safeties lined up in Mexico as if BUs RB was going to pass it deep). This isn't some shocker. Bedford has been fired before, in our beloved BigXII conference. So was Watson. Both are better position coaches and in over their head as big time conf coordinators.

To be clear though, Mack lost coordinators who were doing very well because they were hired as HCs by other teams. That's a "good" problem to have in CFB. At the end he just ran into the problem of trying to force an identity that didn't match his talent.
 
Whoever it was that was complaining about nepotism and loyalty I have a question. Do you watch football? Nepetsim and "who you know" is all coaching is
 
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I think Cal dropping 50 on us like a high school game is freaking unacceptable.
everyone does, I'm just hoping this was the wake up call that was needed. There wasn't much focus on the D last year because the offense was so bad, and for about the 40th season in a row, the D was young. Everyone kind of overlooked the fact that the D was pretty bad in the second half against ND, because it was an exciting win. You never want to lose, but it came at a time where a new focus and adjustments can be made.
 
I agree Horn. Although I think Strong takes to much heat for the Watson hire. It was a bad hire but there is not an OC in this country that was turning Swoops or Hesrd in to anything more than an Avg QB. He brought in a real guy to work with Shane so as far as I'm concerned the Watson deal is in the past
Are you joking? Many many of us threw a dang fit when he hired Watson WAAYYYY before he called the first play at Texas BECAUSE we knew he was an awful choice. If Strong is not to blame then who is exactly?......I hope you don't come back with the "Patterson made him do it" excuse because that is BS. Strong hired him not Patterson. The money given to Watson was not chump change and could have hired 100 OC's better than him. I mean it when I say he could not have done much worse than Watson. Now many of us are saying Bedford is the anchor around Strong's neck. We will see. If Strong fails at Texas it is because of Strong and NO ONE ELSE.

Edit. I submit the very week AFTER Watson was canned Texas was BETTER.
 
Herman hasn't done anything other up and comers haven't. I fully expect Herman to be successful and there are only a handful of jobs he will listen to. He has ZERO reason to simply jump from UofH.
 
Herman hasn't done anything other up and comers haven't. I fully expect Herman to be successful and there are only a handful of jobs he will listen to. He has ZERO reason to simply jump from UofH.
I believe he would listen and jump to USC or Texas if offered. He was never officially offered the USC job last time. He was too much of an unknown. Now not so much...
 
I see what your saying Clob, but Herrman followed that up with a beat down of OU and has another big matchup with Louisville in a few weeks. Little doubt he can coach. I don't have much doubt in Strong honestly
You fellas heed my words and heed them well.......

I know how the PR machine at Texas works-- I've seen it up close for a good portion of my life.

The Herman chatter has started earlier than expected due to our poor performance at Cal and Les Miles ouster from LSU. When Louisville plays Houston in a few weeks, if Louisville wins that game, the Belmont lock step line will be "See-- look how a charlie strong built team plays. They just beat the guy that all of you are lusting after. Sure, there's a new coach, but the CORE of that team was built by Charlie. He will do the same in Austin."

The University is aware of the social issues surrounding society right now- and firing a coach 3/5ths through his 5 year contract COULD come with blowback. Texas wants zero blowback. Texas doesn't want bad press. Texas doesn't want the word "racism" uttered by anyone. It's easier to keep raking in the money and let the staff stick around until that 5th season, than stir the "potential" embers that swirl around any racial camp fire.

I know it sounds cynical--- but I know how their minds work.......
 
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Clob, what if U of H crushes Louisville and makes the playoffs and Charlie shits the bed again this year. Then what would they say?
 
You fellas heed my words and heed them well.......

I know how the PR machine at Texas works-- I've seen it up close for a good portion of my life.

The Herman chatter has started earlier than expected due to our poor performance at Cal and Les Miles ouster from LSU. When Louisville plays Houston in a few weeks, if Louisville wins that game, the Belmont lock step line will be "See-- look how a charlie strong built team plays. They just beat the guy that all of you are lusting after. Sure, there's a new coach, but the CORE of that team was built by Charlie. He will do the same in Austin."

The University is aware of the social issues surrounding society right now- and firing a coach 3/5ths through his 5 year contract COULD come with blowback. Texas wants zero blowback. Texas doesn't want bad press. Texas doesn't want the word "racism" uttered by anyone. It's easier to keep raking in the money and let the staff stick around until that 5th season, than stir the "potential" embers that swirl around any racial camp fire.

I know it sounds cynical--- but I know how their minds work.......

That's cynical, but I don't think it's that as much as it's just aversion to a major costly change. Which pretty much every program has. There is both good and bad in that. Hiring a new football HC at Texas like program is very expensive and very difficult. Not a good look for anyone hiring/firing a guy after 3 seasons regardless of race.
 
Clob, what if U of H crushes Louisville and makes the playoffs and Charlie shits the bed again this year. Then what would they say?

Barring scandal or 5-7 or worse and Strong is here for 2017. That's just the way it is.
 
You fellas heed my words and heed them well.......

I know how the PR machine at Texas works-- I've seen it up close for a good portion of my life.

The Herman chatter has started earlier than expected due to our poor performance at Cal and Les Miles ouster from LSU. When Louisville plays Houston in a few weeks, if Louisville wins that game, the Belmont lock step line will be "See-- look how a charlie strong built team plays. They just beat the guy that all of you are lusting after. Sure, there's a new coach, but the CORE of that team was built by Charlie. He will do the same in Austin."

The University is aware of the social issues surrounding society right now- and firing a coach 3/5ths through his 5 year contract COULD come with blowback. Texas wants zero blowback. Texas doesn't want bad press. Texas doesn't want the word "racism" uttered by anyone. It's easier to keep raking in the money and let the staff stick around until that 5th season, than stir the "potential" embers that swirl around any racial camp fire.

I know it sounds cynical--- but I know how their minds work.......
Well I don't think race should have anything to do with this positive or negetive. I get there are probably some that don't like that there is a black man(with a white wife) as the head coach of Texas. Do those people I would say deal with it. We're here to play football and if he builds a winner here then who cares.
At the same time just because he's black shouldn't be the reason he's kept either. Now I will say not liking Charlie in the first place for various reasons including race is a big reason why the seat got hot so quick. I think most folks with a brain realize the 2014 and 2015 teams weren't very good and no coach was going to change that.

Weather it's spin or not. It is true that Strongs fingerprints are all over that Louisville roster.
 
Petrino is a hell of a coach, not a hell of a human though. He built a winner there before and if he stays he'll have a great program there. It's pretty simple. Let's not play mental gymnastics to assign these wins to Charlie. That team is Lamar Jackson in Petrino's offense. No one is saying how unbelievable all of these recruits that Charlie left Petrino are other than some UT fans. They are saying Lamar Jackson is the best player in college football.
 
You fellas heed my words and heed them well.......

I know how the PR machine at Texas works-- I've seen it up close for a good portion of my life.

The Herman chatter has started earlier than expected due to our poor performance at Cal and Les Miles ouster from LSU. When Louisville plays Houston in a few weeks, if Louisville wins that game, the Belmont lock step line will be "See-- look how a charlie strong built team plays. They just beat the guy that all of you are lusting after. Sure, there's a new coach, but the CORE of that team was built by Charlie. He will do the same in Austin."

The University is aware of the social issues surrounding society right now- and firing a coach 3/5ths through his 5 year contract COULD come with blowback. Texas wants zero blowback. Texas doesn't want bad press. Texas doesn't want the word "racism" uttered by anyone. It's easier to keep raking in the money and let the staff stick around until that 5th season, than stir the "potential" embers that swirl around any racial camp fire.

I know it sounds cynical--- but I know how their minds work.......
EXCEPT this Louisville team was not built by Strong. How many of the players are Strong's? Can't be that many.
 
Clob, what if U of H crushes Louisville and makes the playoffs and Charlie shits the bed again this year. Then what would they say?
I'm not seeing that happen BUT if it does, the narrative will be shifted elsewhere---- right now Belmont is whistling past the graveyard. Trust me when I tell you---- they are nervous up there.
 
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Petrino is a hell of a coach, not a hell of a human though. He built a winner there before and if he stays he'll have a great program there. It's pretty simple. Let's not play mental gymnastics to assign these wins to Charlie. That team is Lamar Jackson in Petrino's offense. No one is saying how unbelievable all of these recruits that Charlie left Petrino are other than some UT fans. They are saying Lamar Jackson is the best player in college football.
THIS.
 
Hell the Houston roster has a lot of Tony Levine's fingerprints on it also. Is he at a bar somewhere saying you're welcome Herman
 
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EXCEPT this Louisville team was not built by Strong. How many of the players are Strong's? Can't be that many.
Well this is Strongs 3rd year at Texas. That means his final full recruiting class are now seniors and probably a decent number of Jrs Strong had a hand in recruiting to
 
That's cynical, but I don't think it's that as much as it's just aversion to a major costly change. Which pretty much every program has. There is both good and bad in that. Hiring a new football HC at Texas like program is very expensive and very difficult. Not a good look for anyone hiring/firing a guy after 3 seasons regardless of race.


Bubba. There is truth in what you say, but a "major costly change". frankly is nothing. The huge cost is Texas playing games to a less than full stadium and not getting the high profile games with the big paycheck time slots. We got a monster with the Domers, but that is the only one this year. If/when we start winning the LHN becomes very hot indeed and weekend high light games come back to us. The cost of missing out on that makes piddling things like buying out contracts seem insignificant. I hope Charlie can get us there. He is setting the table now. The next few games will decide if he gets to sit down and enjoy the feast himself.
 
So why is nobody talking about Louisville and Clemson this weekend?

I don't know why arent' they? I picked Clemson to go to the playoffs so I can't back off now. Deshawn Watson is off to a slow start he can make a Heisman statement with a great game on Saturday. But Lamar Jackson is having an incredible season can anybody stop him?

And how about ST/WA on Friday night? With the way ND's season is going this could be the last test the Cardinal face this year. Win this one and it could be smooth sailing into the playoffs.

Oh and I almost forgot. OK/TCU is also this Saturday. Now at Texas we know better than to write off OK or at least we should. But whoever loses this game is in for a long, disappointing, season. And I will still have my doubts about the winner. I'm really worried that if Baylor avoids injuries they will run away with the Big XII.
 
4 years will be the benchmark.
I was using this year as the benchmark year. By that I mean, no more blowouts and a team that may not be superior but, at least playing solid on both sides of the ball. I would say like Michigan last year. We are off to a decent start in spite of the ND win not being what we all thought it was, but, we need to finish strong. Last year seemed like no progress was made from day 1 through the end of season. That was the most difficult thing for me because I am Strong supporter. I don't think I can support another flat line improvement year. So, I will see how this season ends and take FlowerBuffs true wisdom advice:
I think we oughta leave the shit alone and see what develops..every time we lose ya'll scream for a new coach...
 
I'm of the belief that a college coach should get at least 4 years at a new job. Especially when taking over for a fired coach and a bad situation. Give them a chance to get at least 3 of their own recruiting classes. Charlie did a full teardown and rebuild. Let the man at least finish the rebuild before trying to ax him.

Chasing a new coach every 3 years leads to instability and prolonged mediocrity.
 
I'm of the belief that a college coach should get at least 4 years at a new job. Especially when taking over for a fired coach and a bad situation. Give them a chance to get at least 3 of their own recruiting classes. Charlie did a full teardown and rebuild. Let the man at least finish the rebuild before trying to ax him.

Chasing a new coach every 3 years leads to instability and prolonged mediocrity.
I know what you mean, but, it can be argued. We sat through McWilliams and Mackovic eras. McWilliams got 5 years which we had 1 good year that was stained by a beatdown by Miami. Mackovic had a better stint in 6 years but, never became the elite level team we all want. Hiring the right guy takes a little luck as well. The right guy has to be available when you are ready to hire.
 
Mack won 8 games with Case freaking McCoy and Mack was a consistently damn good recruiter. I think barring another 6 loss season this year tgen Texas may be tied to him for a couple more years. It will be interesting to see what Texas does with Charlie's contract expiring next year. Also, it was a good win for Houston but I'm really not sure how much of an accomplishment beating OU is this year. Having said that, I do think Herman is a good coach. If Charlie did get fired this year does anyone see Texas going after Miles or Briles?
No and NO
 
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