Night Stalker on Netflix

[Dal_Horn]

We binged it last night. Really well done, and just what a crazy mofo he was. We often leave our windows open at night at our place in Colorado, especially during the summer and fall months. I’m not sure I’m doing that anymore!

And, to @Ketchum point about technology advancements in the last 35 years...digital fingerprint databases, DNA technology, camera technology, internet, video conferencing, etc.

 

[Arteez]

Enjoyed it, but it could have been trimmed to two hours without all the scenery panning and fluff to take up time.

 

[Ketchum]

Enjoyed it, but it could have been trimmed to two hours without all the scenery panning and fluff to take up time.

I would have actually liked one more episode.

 

[HookemHood86]

Finished it today. Absolutely fantastic. Once in every several months, and after several misses, Netflix delivers.

 

[marka1]

I'm just saying in retrospect there were some awful decisions made on numerous levels, which led to evidence to become ruined or let Rameriz get away.... and no one talks about the people that made those decisions, or how high the accountability for those mistakes should have gone.

Who do you think let Ramirez get away and who made the awful decisions?

 

[Ketchum]

Who do you think let Ramirez get away and who made the awful decisions?

a. The decision to pull officers off of the dentist office.

b. The destruction of evidence with the first stolen car they had that was left out in the sun for over a week.

c. Lack of communication between agencies.

Those three stand out,

 

[LJ01]

Where the hell was mayor Thomas Bradley during all of this?

We can berate Feinstein for her mistakes, but it took one murder in her city and she was out in front of cameras addressing the biggest story in her state when I'm not sure I've ever heard of a single political figure in L.A. during the same time making the public's awareness to a serial killer a priority?

Bradley didn’t make the series because he sat on the information as he was supposed too

Feinstein doesn’t need to be a rocket surgeon to ask about sitting on the information

 

[PHILLUP3]

True story, I lived in Southern Cali (Ontario/Upland) most of my life and during that time Ramirez was on the prowl at that time. He was caught in East LA about 35-40 minutes away from where I lived. Fast forward around 2008 I met a woman on Plenty of Fish, we became friends and she loved to jog all the time. One evening she was going out for a jog and I told her to be careful, she said of course she is ever since the incident happened to her when she was younger. I had to ask what incident? She said she had just walked out of her apartment and into the carport when a crazy looking man started to chase her around the carports so she ran into the street yelling for help, some neighbors came over and starting to beat the guy up, turns out it was Richard Ramirez.

 

[Ketchum]

Bradley didn’t make the series because he sat on the information as he was supposed too

In other words, he did nothing for months...

There is nothing on record that I can find that shows he ever had a single press conference.

 

[Ketchum]

True story, I lived in Southern Cali (Ontario/Upland) most of my life and during that time Ramirez was on the prowl at that time. He was caught in East LA about 35-40 minutes away from where I lived. Fast forward around 2008 I met a woman on Plenty of Fish, we became friends and she loved to jog all the time. One evening she was going out for a jog and I told her to be careful, she said of course she is ever since the incident happened to her when she was younger. I had to ask what incident? She said she had just walked out of her apartment and into the carport when a crazy looking man started to chase her around the carports so she ran into the street yelling for help, some neighbors came over and starting to beat the guy up, turns out it was Richard Ramirez.

I don't even know how to respond to that. haha

 

[LJ01]

In other words, he did nothing for months...

There is nothing on record that I can find that shows he ever had a single press conference.

The police didn’t release anything until the last month. Also the investigation was not being run by LAPD. I also believe he knew a lot and didn’t share anything on purpose In order not to jeopardize the investigation. Feinstein made the series because she screwed up.

 

[Ketchum]

The police didn’t release anything until the last month. Also the investigation was not being run by LAPD. I also believe he knew a lot and didn’t share anything on purpose In order not to jeopardize the investigation. Feinstein made the series because she screwed up.

WHERE. WAS. THE. MAYOR'S. OFFICE.

WHERE. WAS. POLICE. LEADERSHIP.

WHERE. WAS. THE. CROSS. AGENCY. COMMUNICATION.

 

[LJ01]

WHERE. WAS. THE. MAYOR'S. OFFICE.

WHERE. WAS. POLICE. LEADERSHIP.

WHERE. WAS. THE. CROSS. AGENCY. COMMUNICATION.

1. Just because you can’t find anything doesn’t mean they didn’t hold press conference. Again they didn’t make the series because they didn’t screw up like Feinstein.
2. Which department?
3. Very Poor

 

[etauch]

What he did to young children...there is certainly a special place in Hell set aside for Richard Ramirez.

 

[marka1]

I don't even know how to respond to that. haha

It is the longest sentence in OB history. Bravo

 

[marka1]

WHERE. WAS. THE. MAYOR'S. OFFICE.

WHERE. WAS. POLICE. LEADERSHIP.

WHERE. WAS. THE. CROSS. AGENCY. COMMUNICATION.

Tom Bradley was in charge of the LA Police Department and then the Mayor. It’s about time to you gave him some credit for solving the crimes.

 

[TLG1]

Was a teenager in OC while this was going on. My parents had left for a couple of days on travel and myself and my younger brother were home alone. During this time there was the thwarted attempt at a home in Mission Viejo. The home was just a couple of miles from my house. The next night my brother and I "booby trapped" all the windows, his preferred entry point. I slept with my baseball bat, and my brother with his ice climbing pickaxe. Good times!

I will definitely be watching this show.

went and looked it up. James Romero's house was about a mile from our house. Bill Carns who was shot, and fiance raped, was 1.5miles from our house. House was on Chrisanta drive. Coming down from LA in that stolen car he would have come down I5 and exited La Paz Drive and turned left on Chrisanta. Thankfully he didn't turn right.

Watching this show again it brings back bad memories and creeps me the **** out.

 

[AZtex11]

I agree 100% with this.

There was a lot of this sort of thing mentioned in the series, but it was glossed over for the most part. The three biggest issues that stood out to me:

1. The fact it took so long for the LA jurisdictions to get on the same page that one dude was doing all this. The lead Hispanic detective (I can't recall his name) on the case was ridiculed for sharing this theory early on. This, I can sort of understand. He was a new detective, and very young for the roll. I can see other detectives telling him "Relax kid, not every murder is a serial killer"

2. The mismanagement of the first car and the prints on it was astounding. This is just incompetence. You've got a potential lead on a known serial killer and you do nothing?

3. The fact the surveillance was stopped on the dentist office was also astounding. Again, only real lead is the killer has horrible teeth. All the victims said this, dental records confirmed it. Another doctor said he'd need work soon cause of an impacted tooth. This is a guy that's killed several people and abducted kids (this is known at this point), and you don't have someone sitting in the dentist office...just in case he shows up?

The complete lack of cooperation of the various jurisdictions in LA was a sub-plot to the entire series, and it wasn't delved into enough. At the very least, there is a lot more there to tell the story of. I think that issue was the driving factor in all three of those issues above.

I wonder if Law Enforcement looks at those issues as training...sort of a case study.

Good post.

So many unanswered questions about the dentist office blunder. Sounds like there was no Plan B. Wasn't there a video camera in the lobby, or was that clip produced present day for the documentary? If there was a camera, why not reference it for visual identification? If not, why not install one in case Plan A failed? Did police have a sketch artist meet with the dentist/staff to produce a more accurate sketch? And why not work with staff in getting his fingerprints? Unless he wore gloves to the dentist, which doesn't make sense if he didn't want to draw attention to himself, they could have easily captured his prints without arousing suspicion. I mean, didn't these guys watch CSI LA back then? 😎

I know it was 35 years ago but that had to be viewed as haphazard surveillance which isn't surprising considering LAPD's reputation back then. That particular example could have served as training on missed opportunities in surveillance and capture.

At this point his picture was released and put on the front page of every major paper. Some dude spotted him on a city bus, and the rest is history.

Sometimes captures involve a little luck. Ramirez went to Tucson, turned around, and immediately returned to LA. Just so happens his picture was released during that same window. He had no idea his face was plastered on newspapers across LA. He was a sitting duck the moment he stepped off the bus from Tucson.

 

[Russhorn]

It took more than one murder. Remember at the end, Ramirez told Falzon that he'd committed a double murder (he identified by the street name) that had never been solved. I wouldn't be at all surprised to learn that there were others in San Fran that were never accounted for.

Luck doesn't excuse Feinstein's blunder. That was incredibly dumb of her, and everyone is lucky that Ramirez was either (a) too compelled to stop himself or (b) to dumb to skip town and set up shop elsewhere. She was incredibly lucky that her idiotic move didn't blow up in their faces and extend the killing spree or begin a new one elsewhere. Of course, I would say the SF police chief has an equal, if not greater, share of the blame because the mayor obviously needed some coaching on how to handle it.

I am sure it’s been discussed but that doesn’t happen if LA allows the case agents to stay at the dental office or install a working alarm. People died because of that stupidity.

This show was awesome because of the two awesome cops who solved it. Loved both those guys and simply can’t imagine the level of job stress they endured to solve that crime. Both examples of the great people who work to protect us.

At the end when the showed the court scenes it caused me to flash back to my 15 year old self watching him live on the news in those shades like a rock star. Had forgotten and didn’t even know he was the guy this was about. I remember thinking that if pure evil walks that is it. I was a kid so I had no context other than the feeling that guy was really ****ing bad.

 

[Change My Name]

I'm just saying in retrospect there were some awful decisions made on numerous levels, which led to evidence to become ruined or let Rameriz get away.... and no one talks about the people that made those decisions, or how high the accountability for those mistakes should have gone.

True, but the high profile mayor bungling a major issue is a bit more noteworthy than identifying, for example, the lowly technician that bungled the alarm int he dentists office. Or the bureaucrat that decided that LA couldn't continue to spend money to stake out the dentist office. You're absolutely right that numerous mistakes were made, but the SF mayor nearly (potentially) blowing up the entire investigation deserves the attention it got.

 

[HotCheeto]

Been waiting to read this thread unti I finished the series. Man, what a doozy. A genuinely evil individual who did not have a single ounce of decency or regard for human life in his body. I think the creepiest part of this all to me is how many murders he likely committed before the spree they pinned on him.

He killed what, 14 people over the span of 5.5 months that they know of for sure? And he admitted to two other murders that happened approximately 9 months before said spree began? No way this dude was dormant in the time between the two murders and the spree they eventually tied him to. He could’ve committed a dozen other murders in that time frame. Just terrifying.

 

[Ketchum]

1. Just because you can’t find anything doesn’t mean they didn’t hold press conference. Again they didn’t make the series because they didn’t screw up like Feinstein.
2. Which department?
3. Very Poor

1. There is no record of Bradley having any involvement with the case, certainly on a public level, until after his capture.

2. all of them.

 

[Ketchum]

True, but the high profile mayor bungling a major issue is a bit more noteworthy than identifying, for example, the lowly technician that bungled the alarm int he dentists office. Or the bureaucrat that decided that LA couldn't continue to spend money to stake out the dentist office. You're absolutely right that numerous mistakes were made, but the SF mayor nearly (potentially) blowing up the entire investigation deserves the attention it got.

Again, where was the leadership in all of the major departments?

 

[LJ01]

1. There is no record of Bradley having any involvement with the case, certainly on a public level, until after his capture.

2. all of them.

You think that his police past didn’t play a roll in his knowledge or his actions. You seriously think he just ignored the situation?

They didn’t go into everything in this series. One major thing they never mentioned is that .22 and .25 calibers are two of the smallest calibers you can obtain. They are not legal for Texas CHL and they are illegal to use on some hunting such as deer. Nobody would have survived being shot with larger caliber options.

 

[FrankS1985]

For a guy that was living out of a Greyhound Bus Depot, he really Hollywooded the hell out of that court case.

He didn't look so great when they picked him up. Lived better in jail / prison than he did on the outside. Didn't get what he deserved in my opinion.

 

[Ketchum]

You think that his police past didn’t play a roll in his knowledge or his actions. You seriously think he just ignored the situation?

They didn’t go into everything in this series. One major thing they never mentioned is that .22 and .25 calibers are two of the smallest calibers you can obtain. They are not legal for Texas CHL and they are illegal to use on some hunting such as deer. Nobody would have survived being shot with larger caliber options.

I question whether he did enough, yes.

 

[ndennis25]

Wasn't there a video camera in the lobby, or was that clip produced present day for the documentary? If there was a camera, why not reference it for visual identification? If not, why not install one in case Plan A failed? Did police have a sketch artist meet with the dentist/staff to produce a more accurate sketch? And why not work with staff in getting his fingerprints?

I think that video of the dentist office was fake stuff they added for drama. Also, there have a been a few posts about the tech from back then vs today. I can't imagine how bad a closed circuit video of him from 1985 would look. I can't imagine that could of been used to ID him.

Maybe they coulda got prints out of the dentist, but that would of required getting in there right after him. Other wise the next person in the chair would mess up the prints. And if the cops where going to arrange that scenario, they should just arrest him.

No way this dude was dormant in the time between the two murders and the spree they eventually tied him to. He could’ve committed a dozen other murders in that time frame. Just terrifying.

Cheeto, this is a great point, and something they touch on very briefly at the end.

There is a great scene where they show the photos and dates of all his known crimes. There is the very first known murder in SF. Then like 18 months later everything starts in LA.

The stuff in 18 occurs hours, days apart for months at a time.

The final scene/shot is simply a shot of like 20 silhouettes representing the potential victims between the first SF victim and the first known LA victim.

 

[Ketchum]

I think that video of the dentist office was fake stuff they added for drama. Also, there have a been a few posts about the tech from back then vs today. I can't imagine how bad a closed circuit video of him from 1985 would look. I can't imagine that could of been used to ID him.

Maybe they coulda got prints out of the dentist, but that would of required getting in there right after him. Other wise the next person in the chair would mess up the prints. And if the cops where going to arrange that scenario, they should just arrest him.


Cheeto, this is a great point, and something they touch on very briefly at the end.

There is a great scene where they show the photos and dates of all his known crimes. There is the very first known murder in SF. Then like 18 months later everything starts in LA.

The stuff in 18 occurs hours, days apart for months at a time.

The final scene/shot is simply a shot of like 20 silhouettes representing the potential victims between the first SF victim and the first known LA victim.

He seems like a guy that would want credit for what was his. He didn't exactly keep his lips sealed on most of this stuff. He was caught, in part, because he told someone about the murders he committed in great detail.

 

[ndennis25]

Oh....here is a stupid question...if someone has time to find this out (I'm stuck at work).

When did that Avia shoe get shipped/sold in LA?
What was the date of his first LA victim?
What was the date of the early victim in SF?

My bet is he bought that shoe just before his first known victim in LA. And there were crime scenes in SF and/or LA with a different shoe print between the 1st SF victim and 1st LA victim.

And, also, this assuming the identified all his victims when he was sporting his Avia kicks.

 

[ndennis25]

He seems like a guy that would want credit for what was his. He didn't exactly keep his lips sealed on most of this stuff. He was caught, in part, because he told someone about the murders he committed in great detail.

Ketch...there is no way there are not more victims during that stretch between the early SF murder and the first LA murder. Its like 18 months.

LA was like a victim every 2-4 days. You will never convince me that he killed someone in SF, moved to LA, then waited 18 months. Then started killing and raping people every 2-4 days for months.

No way....he was doing it the whole time. The cops just didn't ID the cases.

 

[HotCheeto]

He seems like a guy that would want credit for what was his. He didn't exactly keep his lips sealed on most of this stuff. He was caught, in part, because he told someone about the murders he committed in great detail.

I just find it really hard to believe that he could contain himself for the length of time between his “first” murders and the eventual spree he went on. He was committing multiple murders a night at a certain point, so him laying low for 9 months seems almost impossible. If nothing else I feel like he at least committed a few rapes in that timeframe.

 

[Ketchum]

Ketch...there is no way there are not more victims during that stretch between the early SF murder and the first LA murder. Its like 18 months.

LA was like a victim every 2-4 days. You will never convince me that he killed someone in SF, moved to LA, then waited 18 months. Then started killing and raping people every 2-4 days for months.

No way....he was doing it the whole time. The cops just didn't ID the cases.

I didn't say there was no way.... I'm just saying he was a definite talker. Hell, he freely confessed to two of the murders in SF unprovoked to the cops.

 

[HotCheeto]

I didn't say there was no way.... I'm just saying he was a definite talker. Hell, he freely confessed to two of the murders in SF unprovoked to the cops.

I think another piece to that was just the fact he liked f*cking with people, whether it be his victims or the cops themselves. He enjoyed playing mind games and perhaps he just threw that bone out there to get them thinking about all the crimes they might’ve missed.

 

[Ketchum]

I think another piece to that was just the fact he liked f*cking with people, whether it be his victims or the cops themselves. He enjoyed playing mind games and perhaps he just threw that bone out there to get them thinking about all the crimes they might’ve missed.

Maybe, but he WAS a talker. His loose lips partly sank his ship.

 

[Ketchum]

This is wild.

“Night Stalker” Director Talks With BD’s Boo Crew About Richard Ramirez and the Ethics of True Crime Docs [Podcast]

Netflix‘s buzzed-about docuseries “Night Stalker: The Hunt For a Serial Killer” takes viewers back to the sweltering summer of 1985 and tells the true story of how one of the most notorious serial killers in American history was hunted down and brought to justice. Richard Ramirez, also known as...

bloody-disgusting.com

“A crazy footnote to the story is the bars that are on the windows and the houses in [Los Angeles]… that began this summer because it was a hot summer and if you don’t have AC, you’re having to leave your windows open; so if you don’t want the Night Stalker to climb in, people [were] putting up bars. So to this day, all the bars that are over windows in LA are a product of the Night Stalker.”