Big Ten gets MASSIVE television deal

[TexExSpur]

Just one old guy's .02 but the Big 12 needs to add 4 - 6 teams pronto. Drop Bevo Network and go with a Big 12 Network. Cincy, Memphis, USF (Tampa) and UCF (Orlando) additions would make a new Big 12 TV package "pop."

.02

and, Go Cats !! and, Hook 'em for the Wife !!

No, we need it to blow up and move on.

 

[topdecktiger]

My point with Arkansas and Illinois was... yeah, you added them at different times, but so did the Big 12. You're saying, oh, right, drop the dead weight. If that were the ONLY reasonable model for expansion, the Big 10 and SEC would have done it too. And yeah, Illinois is a big state. But they have 2 meh teams from the state. They'd be fine with one or the other. Mississippi and Arkansas aren't big states and one has historically sucked, so having 2 teams from that state, by your logic, makes NO sense. Arkansas was historically good, so I guess it's nice to be able to say you have their historical championships and their non-football sports, but come on. Based on that logic, we might as well add Army, who has 15 times as many football championships AND is from a bigger, more populous state! Or Princeton.... who has 26 times as many and is a much more well known school.... and again, more populous state.

For two, you completely dismiss this as all unrealistic, but I wasn't saying NOW. NOW I stated, rather clearly, that UT should sit it out... with the LHN as a buffer if things are getting worse for the Big 12... until either A) the TV contracts and GOR are over in 2024-2025 or B) enough teams in the conference get sick of the conference situation enough that there are enough institutions that don't want to keep the GOR binding. I truthfully don't know how many that would be, but a lot of conferences' big decisions require about 3/4 vote, so I'd imagine that if around 7 or 8 teams in the conference were done with it all, they could undo the GOR and move on (which may not be likely, but who knows). Texas moving to another conference, at that point, seems like what is most likely to happen... possibly with OU, but who knows... it would depend on if the relationship between the schools gets strained during the in-between period. THAT is what I think is realistic NOW.

If you read what I was talking about, I was referring to the point back when the Big 12 was still figuring out their TV deals and the GOR, and the ACC was looking pretty flimsy, with the Big 10 looking strongly at UVA, UNC, and/or GA Tech.... when FSU and Clemson were pretty unhappy with their basketball conference... before the deal had been made with Notre Dame. At that point? Yeah, lots of teams where either jumping from one conference to another (I mean... Maryland left the freakin ACC! That's just weird...) or strongly considering it, and the ACC looked REALLY vulnerable. Like I said, Miami seemed like the weak link too. FSU and Clemson wanted the ACC to change or they might have left. Miami, given their issues off the field and their lower profile on the field, was worried that they'd be left out. So yeah, at that point, the Big 12 should have done whatever they could, either alone or in conjunction with the SEC and Big 10 (since there are enough attractive schools in the ACC to go around if those three conferences were going to stop at 16 at the highest). The powers that be (maybe with the support of DeLoss Dodds) didn't do that then, and I still think that was the death knell of the conference... just slow motion (and one of the few things that I'm really critical of Dodds about if he actually was involved in that decision, and the decision not to work something out with the Pac 12).

See? If you actually respond to what I said and not what you wanted to tell me I was wrong about, it makes more sense.

For now, though, I think Texas is in a not-ideal-but-they'll-be-fine situation, in a Big 12 with no ideal expansion options... but that is actually a pretty good conference on-the-field, if it weren't for the small footprint. Teams from the conference will do fine in the playoff model for now. The LHN won't be popular with the rest of the conference because it doesn't help them, and it prevents a conference network from really making sense, but given the fact that we sat on our hands when there WERE reasonable expansion options (when the ACC was vulnerable, not now), ditching the LHN and starting a conference network would be basically a demotion for Texas as far as money and staying competitive... and the conf network would likely only be a temporary patch for the conference, that would help a little but not do enough to keep it as financially competitive as we'd like. So, we can either "lose" to help the conference "not win", but not "lose" as quickly. Or we can stay where we are, doing pretty well until the time comes when the conference schools will have to decide whether they're staying or going and have a plan ready for when that comes up.

But yeah, I never said that right now FSU and Clemson would join. And if you really think that, if it HAD happened, that adding Miami, FSU, GA Tech, Clemson, Notre Dame and... Pitt, VA Tech, or Louisville... to the current Big 12 would just not have made them competitive because of Iowa State and Texas Tech... like I said, Illinois/Northwestern... Mississippi State/Mississippi... all conferences have teams that you would be referring to as "dead weight". That doesn't mean that they're likely to shed them because somehow that's the only thing that makes sense.

Ok, to the first point. You keep trying to draw a parallel between teams like Mississippi or Illinois to teams like Texas Tech. That comparison doesn’t work. The reason is, the Big Ten and SEC both have the ability to overcome their “dead weight” in ways the other conferences can’t. The Big Ten has a bunch of big state schools in large, populous states. They can deliver big ratings/audience to networks, hence the new Fox contract. The SEC has a bunch of nationally prominent programs (Alabama, Florida, LSU, Auburn, etc.) that can deliver big TV ratings. Neither of those conferences needs to be concerned about a Vanderbilt here, or Northwestern there. It’s not a problem for them. Other conferences don’t have that luxury. The Big 12 has Texas and Oklahoma, but has a small media footprint. The ACC has a big media footprint, but doesn’t have a lot of good/prominent teams. That’s why you see the disparity in pay between the conferences. The point is, the Big Ten and SEC have built in advantages, so you can’t just say that because something works in those two conferences, it will work in other conferences.


The other point is the one you raised about what the Big 12 should have done a few years ago. I did address it, and you overlooked it (which is what you said I did). One big problem is that the Big 12 has clauses in its TV contract which limit the ability to expand. If the Big 12 adds teams, they don’t get to open up the TV contract and renegotiate, like the other leagues do. The Big 12 has a clause whereby when new teams are added, the TV contract only increases to make up the difference for adding the new teams. In other words, if the TV contract pays out $20 million per school now, the contract would go up just enough so the payout would still be $20 million with the new teams. The problem with that is, you really can’t attract new schools (good ones) without being able to offer a significant increase in revenue. Otherwise, it’s just a lateral move for potential new schools. When all this talk of Florida St to the Big 12 was going on, then-president Eric Barron sent out a letter to the booster club, in which he outlined how a move would not be profitable for Florida St. He mentioned the exact contract issue I just noted. Plus, he outlined how the move would result in +$2 million in yearly travel expenses for Florida St, which would negate the difference between the ACC & Big 12 payouts. Beyond that, there simply wasn’t this desire for school to leave, like you are saying. It was rumor on message boards. I can tell you for a fact that Clemson wasn’t ever considering leaving. Clemson simply doesn’t have an issue with the ACC. That’s something fans from other schools just assume and post on message boards. Florida St’s administration actually doesn’t have a problem with the ACC either. It’s Florida St’s fans that do. And there, it’s not that they have a problem with the conference so much. It’s that they don’t like getting trash talk from Florida fans about the SEC. Well, the problem is that rival trash talk is not a legitimate foundation for switching conferences. That’s why all this stuff about switching conferences is unrealistic. It’s also why it would take something drastic, like a merger, for it to actually happen.

 

[mm42]

Ok, to the first point. You keep trying to draw a parallel between teams like Mississippi or Illinois to teams like Texas Tech. That comparison doesn’t work.

Another difference is Ole Miss doesn't suck at football. Their boosters got tired of losing and $tepped way up.

 

[Panthergrowl13]

The Big 12 has 6 schools (Oklahoma,Oklahoma State,Kansas,Kansas State,Iowa State and West Virginia) that have a combined population base of only about 10 million (Iowa shared).

A big 12 network cannot be formed without Texas giving up the LHN and the $15 million per year in revenue.

Problem is Texas would not be able to recoup the loss in revenue a Big12 Network would provide.

Oklahoma also appears to be exploring its future options.

HAIL TO PITT!!!!

 

[NU 71 72 74]

No, we need it to blow up and move on.

Wonder how many of the Big 12 teams wish that Texas would simply "move on" rather than blowing up the conference. With the LHN gone as well as Texas, the various institutions would be free to form a new conference adding 5 teams instead of the four mentioned in my previous post.

Again, Texas would die on the vine as an independent. The Eyes of Texas reside pretty much within the state of Texas. You are NOT Notre Dame.

.02

and, Go Cats !! and, Hook 'em for the Wife !

 

[speedstrength]

We have almost a half million alumni all over the world and we add 8-10k to that number ever year. We were tops in total revenue again at almost 180 million dollars and over 70 million of that was licensing and royalty revenue. I am fairly confident that those numbers are driven by longhorn fans all over the country.

 

[NU 71 72 74]

We have almost a half million alumni all over the world and we add 8-10k to that number ever year. We were tops in total revenue again at almost 180 million dollars and over 70 million of that was licensing and royalty revenue. I am fairly confident that those numbers are driven by longhorn fans all over the country.

Ok, how's the LHN working out for you guys ?

 

[LonghornSoldier]

No, those schools are simply the best available TV markets. If Texas needs the money (it doesn't) I suspect you better get on the horn to either the SEC, B1G, or PAC. Only Notre Dame can make it as an independent. Eye balls follow Notre Dame -- Texas would die on the vine if it depended on national TV viewership.

.02

and, Go Cats !! and, Hook 'em for the Wife !!

This has to be the dumbest thing I ever read..... Texas couldnt make it as an independent? Just bc your school sucks balls to the tune of needing to be in a conference, Texas is one of the only schools aside from ND that could pull off the indy status.....

 

[LonghornSoldier]

Ok, how's the LHN working out for you guys ?

Its working out fine from what I can tell... lining our pockets with even more money..... come to think of it, I think Texas has more money than any other school in the country....And just for the hell of it, name another school that has a dedicated network for themselves only that is partnered with ESPN.... seems to me we are sitting nice and pretty with the checks flowing in from this....

 

[NU 71 72 74]

This has to be the dumbest thing I ever read..... Texas couldnt make it as an independent? Just bc your school sucks balls to the tune of needing to be in a conference, Texas is one of the only schools aside from ND that could pull off the indy status.....

Then go "indy", what's holding you back. ?

.02

and, Go Cats !! and, Hook 'em for the Wife !

 

[BringBackRoyal]

Ok, how's the LHN working out for you guys ?

I think going independent is an absurd idea, and it's one that's fortunately DOA with the UT administration, but just to answer this question, it's working out just fine. Paying us many millions every year. (Will finally turn a profit for ESPN this year, too, not that I give a damn.)

 

[bubba2023]

Then go "indy", what's holding you back. ?

.02

and, Go Cats !! and, Hook 'em for the Wife !

Probably none of us having any say in the matter? Texas isn't seceding and UT isn't going independent. Any arguments for or against are pure conjecture. The theories will never be field tested.

 

[SatydogHorn]

Again, Texas would die on the vine as an independent. The Eyes of Texas reside pretty much within the state of Texas.

You are NOT Notre Dame. and, Go Cats !! and, Hook 'em for the Wife ![/QUOTE]

 

[SatydogHorn]

Ok, how's the LHN working out for you guys ?

Watching right now!

 

[TexExSpur]

Wonder how many of the Big 12 teams wish that Texas would simply "move on" rather than blowing up the conference. With the LHN gone as well as Texas, the various institutions would be free to form a new conference adding 5 teams instead of the four mentioned in my previous post.

Again, Texas would die on the vine as an independent. The Eyes of Texas reside pretty much within the state of Texas. You are NOT Notre Dame.

.02

and, Go Cats !! and, Hook 'em for the Wife !

Texas and OU are the cash cows for the conference and its true survival is up to them, if one bolts... they both bolt.


Indy is out of the question for all teams moving forward, they will have to be aligned with a conference. Yes, even the Catholics whom are half ass Indy at this point and tied to the ACC.

We're, TEXAS.

 

[BringBackRoyal]

Wonder how many of the Big 12 teams wish that Texas would simply "move on" rather than blowing up the conference.

The fans or the schools?

I'm sure loads of uninformed fans would like to see it. I would hope that the schools are run by people intelligent enough to understand that Texas's (shortsighted) decision to go for the LHN instead of moving to a new conference is the only reason the majority of them are still in a P5 league.

The continued existence of the Big 12 beyond the next nine years is already in grave doubt; if Texas (or OU) leaves, the league is finished. Sure, the programs left behind can probably keep the name and add a bunch of schools with small to tiny fan bases, but the Big 12 as a P5 league will be dead.

 

[Scholz]

Again, Texas would die on the vine as an independent.

Dumb comment proven completely wrong by our top revenue streams (top apparel sales in the country for a decade straight without being Oh My Gosh ND - please explain that) and huge fanbase so you switch to...

Ok, how's the LHN working out for you guys ?

Another dumb comment. It's going great. What's your point? Followed up by...

Then go "indy", what's holding you back. ?

A third dumb comment. Because it's easier to be in a conference. Duh. Doesn't mean we couldn't. These things aren't mutually exclusive, Mr. Erudite Northwestern.

 

[TexExSpur]

Big 10 is a perfect fit except for geographically speaking, but...being the only team in the South and being Texas would have it's benefits. Big 10 fans will be disappointed if that happens, No?

 

[cwillfromdatx]

Ok, how's the LHN working out for you guys ?

I'm watching it but tell me. Can you watch your school program as I type? Can you watched all everything of your school anytime? I can. Haters going to hate as they say

 

[bubba2023]

The LHN is great for Texas. As far as the LHN being a joke that was when there was no distribution and no one could even watch and we were forcing games to tier 3. At this point pretty much most major carriers picked up the LHN so it's availability is widespread. It's a great deal for Texas, but not for the rest of the big 12 who would like to split revenue of a conference network.

 

[topdecktiger]

Dumb comment proven completely wrong by our top revenue streams (top apparel sales in the country for a decade straight without being Oh My Gosh ND - please explain that) and huge fanbase so you switch to...


Another dumb comment. It's going great. What's your point? Followed up by...


A third dumb comment. Because it's easier to be in a conference. Duh. Doesn't mean we couldn't. These things aren't mutually exclusive, Mr. Erudite Northwestern.

Nobody can make it as an independent. Notre Dame is not independent. They play all their other sports in a conference, and they have contracted close to half their football games with a conference. They are independent in name only.

 

[LonghornSoldier]

Then go "indy", what's holding you back. ?

.02

and, Go Cats !! and, Hook 'em for the Wife !

Well, that nagging thing called reality which shows that there is no reason for Texas to entertain going independant. But just bc we dont or have no plans to doesnt mean we wouldnt be able to succeed doing it. To think otherwise is about as naive as you can be. Texas has one of the largest and most diverse alumni bases known to man.....and more money than anyone else in the world of NCAA..... I get that you are butthurt and ignorant bc you are not a Horn and dont understand reality etc, but you need to take your baited trash replies to another board and kindly kick rocks till we cant see you here anymore.

I thought Northwesterngrads were supposed to be smart, etc... thanks for showing that some NU grads seemed to carry the same sense of stupidity the cult in b/cs does..... now thanks for playing, and dont let the door hit you on the way out.

 

[CaptainZigZag]

Dumb comment proven completely wrong by our top revenue streams (top apparel sales in the country for a decade straight without being Oh My Gosh ND - please explain that) and huge fanbase so you switch to...


Another dumb comment. It's going great. What's your point? Followed up by...


A third dumb comment. Because it's easier to be in a conference. Duh. Doesn't mean we couldn't. These things aren't mutually exclusive, Mr. Erudite Northwestern.

This sack of purple shit pops over from time to time (he can't help himself) to make some kind of passive/aggressive comment. And his gay ass "hook em for the wife" kind of is an indication that she has his on testicle at home in a mason jar

 

[Scholz]

Nobody can make it as an independent. Notre Dame is not independent. They play all their other sports in a conference, and they have contracted close to half their football games with a conference. They are independent in name only.

BYU

 

[speedstrength]

BYU

I believe all of BYU's other sports are in the WCC

 

[topdecktiger]

BYU

As the other poster said, BYU has all its other sports in the WCC, which is the same point I made about Notre Dame.

That said, you and I have different definitions of "making it." BYU gets a whopping $4 million a year from their TV contract, and their bowl tie in is the Las Vegas bowl. If that's what you call "making it," more power to you. I myself will take Bronco Mendenhall's word:
“I don’t think it’s sustainable,” he said of BYU’s independent status. “I was trying everything I knew how to do to advance and pioneer that part. If I were to be really blunt about it, I took it as far as I could go in relation to that setting of independence.http://www.usatoday.com/story/sport...nhall-college-football-byu-virginia/80756712/

 

[TexExSpur]

BYU

They want in a conference in a bad way.

 

[Scholz]

Points taken re: ND and BYU. Still, UT has led the country in apparel revenue for a decade straight, has its own tv channel and is the most profitable athletic dept out there. I don't think it's fair to out of hand dismiss UT's chances of being quasi or semi independent at all. UT is a different animal than almost everyone. I'm sure conferences would line up to take UT's non-football sports in ala ND. And football teams would line up to schedule UT in football.

That said, this is all a moot discussion since UT will keep this conference together.

 

[topdecktiger]

Points taken re: ND and BYU. Still, UT has led the country in apparel revenue for a decade straight, has its own tv channel and is the most profitable athletic dept out there. I don't think it's fair to out of hand dismiss UT's chances of being quasi or semi independent at all. UT is a different animal than almost everyone. I'm sure conferences would line up to take UT's non-football sports in ala ND. And football teams would line up to schedule UT in football.

That said, this is all a moot discussion since UT will keep this conference together.

If we're just talking quasi-independence, that's a different story. Even in that instance, the total amount of revenue would still be less that it is now. It would make no sense to go semi-independent for less money, with no counterbalancing benefit.

 

[Scholz]

Agree. And it won't happen anyway.