OT: Orlando police

[clob94]

But we got to change it clob...not just give up. I don't think the candidates are "out to get us" or "only care about themselves"...

I do know that a Nation Divided will not stand. It is time to look in the mirror. Are you getting the information you "want" or the information you "need"? Don't just put it on a channel that will tell you what you want to hear. Get both sides and forget the "R" and "D" and do the right thing.

you know we don't have it so bad. We are a pretty damn great country. When people talk about the government like it is a snake waiting to bite us it bothers me. We pat soldiers on the back and then turn around and slap them in the face and say "everything you did was for nothing" ....Why is everyone (well mainly the far right) so apt to blow up our government and start over? What is so BAD about our Country? I really want to know.

Bro, I just got back from west Africa. If you saw my twitter thing, you know that I know we don't have it that bad. I put things in perspective. But like that bearded dude said in Braveheart- "The council? They couldn't agree on the color of shite!"
Ya bro, that's our "council" now. Up is down, water is dry, black is racist, and the sky is grape juice. Soooooo, how did the Scots rid themselves of their "council"?

 

[oldhorn2]

The reason people don't vote in this country is because they know their vote doesn't matter. It counts...they all count, but it doesn't matter who wins because nothing ever changes.Clob was spot on.

 

[LongfellowDrew]

After the smoke clears nothing will happen as usual. The gun collectors will have collected a few more guns because of fear of their 2nd amendment rights being taken away and the rest of us will go back to doing what we do. Things will be forgotten in a couple of months until this happens again. It's the way things seem to work in the U.S. right now.

 

[ekal48]

The quicker we all realize that there are 350 million political agendas in this country, and you're never going to get everything you want, and your belief system is marginalized, the more you'll realize that you, yes all of you, are just boot makers to kings--- myself included. No matter who leads this country, the elected officials are never going yo allow you insight into "their" world. The left and right hate Trump because he's a wild card that could ruin their cushy lives by exposing them for the leaches of the system that they are. The right hates Hillary because they see her as evil and a criminal and a liar. A choice between the lesser of two evils is still evil. The days of true statesmen are gone boys. The days of a level headed uniting individual are done. There are 20% of Americans on this side and 20% of Americans on that side and the other 40% of us in the middle going "what the fvck?"

Good post, but I'll take it one step farther.

The national leaders, and what we see on the evening news, either "liberal or conservative" is nothing more than a dog and pony show.

Money is so concentrated and powerful now the people that really make the rules are not seen. They like things just the way you called it, 20% on one side, 20% on the other and the rest don't know what is going or don't give a shit.

 

[swVAHorn]

Bro, I just got back from west Africa. If you saw my twitter thing, you know that I know we don't have it that bad. I put things in perspective. But like that bearded dude said in Braveheart- "The council? They couldn't agree on the color of shite!"
Ya bro, that's our "council" now. Up is down, water is dry, black is racist, and the sky is grape juice. Soooooo, how did the Scots rid themselves of their "council"?

Clob you are a smart guy and probably smarter than me....but do you think "our" Government is so bad and so out of control that it needs to be replaced by a different government? I just don't want to misunderstand what anyone is saying. I think there are people in our government who should be voted out and replaced no doubt....but removing the entire government and starting over? The reason they don't work together is no one holds them accountable AND like I said compromise is not a dirty word. I know it seems I pick on the right but I am only trying to be honest with myself, the right has gone into "don't go along with anything" and that is dangerous. Trump might be the change you speak of BUT it might be the worst change any of us have ever seen. When good men who have been in the Republican party their whole lives are NOT voting for him and saying he is dangerous....?...well I have never seen that in my lifetime...and I don't think it is because they are "afraid" of losing some magical power some people think that our government has. I believe our government works best when BOTH sides give a little. I don't want the Dems or the Reps to have TOTAL control...that should also scare us all.

 

[swVAHorn]

By the way in ANY free society the people who have MONEY have power. Not unique or some Earth shattering statement there. Our votes do matter. People died for all of us to have that power. We pick who we want. The problem is some people are leaders and some are led. Some people think for themselves and some have others think for them.

There are people on both sides who would vote for a damn snake if there was a "D" or "R" by their name. It drives me crazy. And they fall for every line of "if you vote for them you hate America" or "we can't make it 4 more years with X".....Gawd

 

[oldhorn2]

This will be the first election in my memory where democrat and republican alike will go to the polls ,not to vote for somebody, but to vote against the other. There has always been some of this but this time is different. I think that will be the mentality of the majority of folks that vote.

The congress will continue to not solve any problems, because they are exempt from them. They wont solve SS because they are exempt from it. They wont solve health care because they have their own closed system that we have no access to. They dont ever pay for food or bar bills....ever.

 

[Scholz]

we have a sympathizer in the White House, hate to break it to you.

Yes. The US President is for Muslim terrorists destroying our country. Despite the several thousand Al Qaeda and ISIS militants/insurgents/terrorists he's killed via drone strikes and special ops. Including Osama bin Laden. But Obama's a secret Muslim who hates America and wasn't even born here, right?

This is why we have Trump and why we can't discuss politics rationally. People like you who are impervious to facts and reality and are driven solely by hate, fear, bigotry, right wing propaganda and lies, controlled by your lizard brain.

 

[swVAHorn]

Yes. The US President is for Muslim terrorists destroying our country. Despite the several thousand Al Qaeda and ISIS militants/insurgents/terrorists he's killed via drone strikes and special ops. Including Osama bin Laden. But Obama's a secret Muslim who hates America and wasn't even born here, right?

This is why we have Trump and why we can't discuss politics rationally. People like you who are impervious to facts and reality and are driven solely by hate, fear, bigotry, right wing propaganda and lies, controlled by your lizard brain.

yeah Scholz I let that comment douche made go because you can't talk reasonable to someone who doesn't have reason. He "wants" to believe it so he believes it. Truth doesn't matter to him. THIS is a huge problem with we Americans right now. We don't like the news...well just attack them....don't like the fact they caught us in a lie.....attack them. I get frustrated with it. Radio shows are driving hate like I have never seen before.

 

[swVAHorn]

There is people in Scotland waving Mexican flags because of Trump. There are petitions with over half a million signatures to not allow Trump in the UK. Has anyone ever seen anything like this? Is it all a conspiracy to keep "change" out of the U.S.? I don't believe it is.

 

[Belldozer1]

Yes. The US President is for Muslim terrorists destroying our country. Despite the several thousand Al Qaeda and ISIS militants/insurgents/terrorists he's killed via drone strikes and special ops. Including Osama bin Laden. But Obama's a secret Muslim who hates America and wasn't even born here, right?

This is why we have Trump and why we can't discuss politics rationally. People like you who are impervious to facts and reality and are driven solely by hate, fear, bigotry, right wing propaganda and lies, controlled by your lizard brain.

Haha his half ass way of attacking ISIS and radical Islam is a running joke around the world. It's pretty bad when you have to admire the way Putin had dealt with them. No political correctness. Putin also telling immigrants that you will abide by our laws or gtfo. The president said he was going to fundamentally change America well that's according to his beliefs. You tell me why minorities are protesting Trump rallies? If they are here legally what's the issue? Are they upset their relatives aren't just going to be able to stroll in as if tgere were no borders? That makes no sense and the majority of Americans are ready for the current regime to take their sympathizing ways and take a hike. You and your ilk fixing to be real angry going forward.

 

[Scholz]

You are what's wrong with the country and world. You are mindless hater.

 

[elcapitan009]

Haha his half ass way of attacking ISIS and radical Islam is a running joke around the world. It's pretty bad when you have to admire the way Putin had dealt with them. No political correctness. Putin also telling immigrants that you will abide by our laws or gtfo. The president said he was going to fundamentally change America well that's according to his beliefs. You tell me why minorities are protesting Trump rallies? If they are here legally what's the issue? Are they upset their relatives aren't just going to be able to stroll in as if tgere were no borders? That makes no sense and the majority of Americans are ready for the current regime to take their sympathizing ways and take a hike. You and your ilk fixing to be real angry going forward.

You want a president like Putin? God, you're a clueless idiot.

I don't like Trump. Me and my whole family are here legally. I don't like him because he plays on people's racist tendencies. People like you. People who think that, because I'm Latin, I must have a bunch of familia just waiting to get across the border and into this country.

No. You are not the majority. You are a vocal, outspoken, UGLY little part of the country but you will never become the United States. If you do not like that we are a tolerant society regardless of creed, culture, sexuality, race, you can get the fk out. This is OUR country. Not yours.

Move to Russia.

 

[Texxxxas]

You want a president like Putin? God, you're a clueless idiot.

I don't like Trump. Me and my whole family are here legally. I don't like him because he plays on people's racist tendencies. People like you. People who think that, because I'm Latin, I must have a bunch of familia just waiting to get across the border and into this country.

No. You are not the majority. You are a vocal, outspoken, UGLY little part of the country but you will never become the United States. If you do not like that we are a tolerant society regardless of creed, culture, sexuality, race, you can get the fk out. This is OUR country. Not yours.

Move to Russia.

Well said man. I had some other words for belldozer, but I like how you put it.

 

[Belldozer1]

You are what's wrong with the country and world. You are mindless hater.

Scholz don't forget about that secret email server issue either. Sure other SOS's have had private email BUT she's the FIRST to ever have a personal server. Wonder what was passed on thru that? Russia sure seems to be ready to call her bluff and release some emails of her they allegedly have. Are they waiting for the DNC to expose her? If so its lights out and it will be her fault for just another set of lies getting exposed. And honestly Scholz, you're real big on this virtual sports board about calling out people for being hypocrites and have no moral compass yet in REAL LIFE you support the worst perpetrator of all? Why is that? Seriously?

 

[swVAHorn]

You are what's wrong with the country and world. You are mindless hater.

That the village idiot thinks "only minorities" are protesting at Trump rallies does not surprise any of us. Racist douche.

You want a president like Putin? God, you're a clueless idiot.

I don't like Trump. Me and my whole family are here legally. I don't like him because he plays on people's racist tendencies. People like you. People who think that, because I'm Latin, I must have a bunch of familia just waiting to get across the border and into this country.

No. You are not the majority. You are a vocal, outspoken, UGLY little part of the country but you will never become the United States. If you do not like that we are a tolerant society regardless of creed, culture, sexuality, race, you can get the fk out. This is OUR country. Not yours.

Move to Russia.

Well said elcapitan. That is a great statement and it makes me feel better that not everyone has lost their mind. The U.S. is strong because we come from everywhere....not weaker.

 

[Belldozer1]

You want a president like Putin? God, you're a clueless idiot.

I don't like Trump. Me and my whole family are here legally. I don't like him because he plays on people's racist tendencies. People like you. People who think that, because I'm Latin, I must have a bunch of familia just waiting to get across the border and into this country.

No. You are not the majority. You are a vocal, outspoken, UGLY little part of the country but you will never become the United States. If you do not like that we are a tolerant society regardless of creed, culture, sexuality, race, you can get the fk out. This is OUR country. Not yours.

Move to Russia.

So Trump is not wanting to close off US access to anyone here legally but you hate him? Ok well that's your opinion but you need to understand enforcing laws already in place and expecting folks to register before they waltz on over it I s not being racist or bigoted it is being smart. I have no problems if peace loving people are of Muslim faith. It's the radical i have an issue with and I have an issue with them coming over the border. And yes Putin has done a fantastic job of getting after ISIS whether you like it or not. Nobody said I wanted him as president but he's not afraid to confront an issue and deal with it. Our president is considered weak, world wide. That's not just my opinion it's felt world wide. I would love for you to lay out what AND why you don't like Trumps policies and why you think Hillary's are better? Are you an open border advocate? Just a country with no borders? You sound like your're misinformed on the issues, like a sheeple.

 

[Scholz]

On ignore.

 

[Belldozer1]

On ignore.

Typical. Just own up and admit you talk out of both sides of your mouth or explain your rational for supporting someone of her moral and ethical character?

 

[Texxxxas]

On ignore.

I followed suit.

 

[Belldozer1]

I followed suit.

I don't blame you either for not wanting to lay out why you support Hillary and how Trump is wrong.

 

[elcapitan009]

On ignore.

You're right.

I followed suit.

How?

 

[swVAHorn]

You're right.


How?

the best way is to click on the avatar of the person you want to ignore. there is an ignore button and just click it. easy.

 

[elcapitan009]

All of our problems are because of "-----" vote for me and I will get rid of "-----"....The guy is awful but l

the best way is to click on the avatar of the person you want to ignore. there is an ignore button and just click it. easy.

you are a gentleman and a scholar. ahhh, i can taste that sweet, sweet fresh air now that ther'es no thread crapping

 

[clob94]

People died for all of us to have that power. We pick who we want. The problem is some people are leaders and some are led. Some people think for themselves and some have others think for them.

SWVAHORN, you are right-- people died for us to be free of a government that wasn't treating all people equally under the law............"When governments fear the people, there is liberty. When the people fear the government, there is tyranny."

That's Thomas Jefferson right there. Ask 100 people why they pay taxes and 99 will say "because if I don't they will take everything I own and put me in jail".... Hell, that's why I pay mine. That's fear. I'm afraid to lose all my sh!t, so I make sure to give them SOME of my sh!t every year. And don't kid yourself, some people give WAY more of their sh!t every year than others. And where does my sh!t go? What is my sh!t spent on? Well, mostly things I don't use---- like medicare, or social security--- which btw I am too young to use and by the time I will be able to it's mathematically proven that it will be gone---
The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants. It is it's natural manure.--- same guy said that--- TJ-- Now, far be it from me to question one of the most important people in our nation's history-- He was THERE. I am just a student of history-- but what we currently have in Washington are people concerned with one thing and one thing only--- getting re-elected.

Congress has a 12% approval rating--- yet 92% of them were re-elected last cycle. Can you explain that to me??

I can---- like to hear it? Here it go--

We as American want everything WE are involved in to be AWESOME! We project that the most on our kids-- our kids are SPECIAL. If our kids show the slightest bit of athletic ability we run out an sign them up for select ball. If our kid makes the elementary honor roll, we slap a bumper sticker on our truck. Our kids ROCK! Why? Because they are OURS! But what happens when your kid gets in trouble at school? We surely it isn't his fault.....the teacher must be out to get him! There's another student that is distracting him or making him act out. He doesn't do this at home-- so it must be someone else's fault because my kid ROCKS 100% of the time!

We see our kids as extensions of US. And if our kid sucks, it must mean we suck....right? I mean, the kid has your DNA--
Take this thinking and substitute "Congressman" with "kid".

My congressman is AWESOME! It's YOUR congressman that is fvking this up for everybody else! Why is my congressman awesome, because I voted for him! HE's MINE! and everything I am a part of must be special,,,,,,,, right?? Remember-- 12% approval but 92% re-election--

Reality-- your kids aren't that "special" and neither is your elected official. And like most people that don;t hold their child accountable (grounding child, spanking child, teaching child say things like yes ma'am and no sir) Your congressman has ZERO respect for you. ZERO. I don't care what he/she says to your face. Nobody should go to Washington and come home WEALTHIER than when they got there. But they all do.

I hold it, that a little rebellion, now and then, is a good thing, and as necessary in the political world as storms in the physical.
Don't take my word for it- Take the word of one of the guys who was ACTUALLY there--

 

[swVAHorn]

People died for all of us to have that power. We pick who we want. The problem is some people are leaders and some are led. Some people think for themselves and some have others think for them.

SWVAHORN, you are right-- people died for us to be free of a government that wasn't treating all people equally under the law............"When governments fear the people, there is liberty. When the people fear the government, there is tyranny."

That's Thomas Jefferson right there. Ask 100 people why they pay taxes and 99 will say "because if I don't they will take everything I own and put me in jail".... Hell, that's why I pay mine. That's fear. I'm afraid to lose all my sh!t, so I make sure to give them SOME of my sh!t every year. And don't kid yourself, some people give WAY more of their sh!t every year than others. And where does my sh!t go? What is my sh!t spent on? Well, mostly things I don't use---- like medicare, or social security--- which btw I am too young to use and by the time I will be able to it's mathematically proven that it will be gone---
The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants. It is it's natural manure.--- same guy said that--- TJ-- Now, far be it from me to question one of the most important people in our nation's history-- He was THERE. I am just a student of history-- but what we currently have in Washington are people concerned with one thing and one thing only--- getting re-elected.

Congress has a 12% approval rating--- yet 92% of them were re-elected last cycle. Can you explain that to me??

I can---- like to hear it? Here it go--

We as American want everything WE are involved in to be AWESOME! We project that the most on our kids-- our kids are SPECIAL. If our kids show the slightest bit of athletic ability we run out an sign them up for select ball. If our kid makes the elementary honor roll, we slap a bumper sticker on our truck. Our kids ROCK! Why? Because they are OURS! But what happens when your kid gets in trouble at school? We surely it isn't his fault.....the teacher must be out to get him! There's another student that is distracting him or making him act out. He doesn't do this at home-- so it must be someone else's fault because my kid ROCKS 100% of the time!

We see our kids as extensions of US. And if our kid sucks, it must mean we suck....right? I mean, the kid has your DNA--
Take this thinking and substitute "Congressman" with "kid".

My congressman is AWESOME! It's YOUR congressman that is fvking this up for everybody else! Why is my congressman awesome, because I voted for him! HE's MINE! and everything I am a part of must be special,,,,,,,, right?? Remember-- 12% approval but 92% re-election--

Reality-- your kids aren't that "special" and neither is your elected official. And like most people that don;t hold their child accountable (grounding child, spanking child, teaching child say things like yes ma'am and no sir) Your congressman has ZERO respect for you. ZERO. I don't care what he/she says to your face. Nobody should go to Washington and come home WEALTHIER than when they got there. But they all do.

I hold it, that a little rebellion, now and then, is a good thing, and as necessary in the political world as storms in the physical.
Don't take my word for it- Take the word of one of the guys who was ACTUALLY there--

That was my point about "we" have to make each person elected accountable. It is not them who is the problem it is US.

Rebellion just for the sake of rebellion? I don't comprehend this. I pay taxes because I want schools, roads, protection, and on and on. yes some of my taxes goes to things I don't like.....but is that a reason to rebel? What is so bad in this country that we need to overthrow the government and start over? What form of government would we put in place? Change change change.....it is all I hear anymore. Change can be for the worse. Change is not always for the better. People have lost respect for other people in our country. Nothing is held sacred anymore. Hey, disagree with the President! That is great! But do we have to disrespect the very OFFICE of President? I don't think so. We don't have to rush to the bottom. Tell the American people HOW you are going to change this or that...don't tell us the other guy is going to take our liberties and destroy the country....I see it now a candidate says "I think taxes should be ___" the other candidate says "see they want to destroy the country" instead of what their plan is.....I am just fed up with it.

I stand by saying this is a great country.....the best. I will defend it no matter the cost. I mean every word of it. Anybody who wants to end this country will have to go through people like me. We don't walk away after being punched...we punch back. There is good in this country. There is kindness. Not everything is crap. We are not barely hanging on. The apocalypse is not upon us. I wish the hyperbole would stop. When there is this much hyperbole then when someone comes along who is truly dangerous no one will listen.

 

[LongfellowDrew]

That was my point about "we" have to make each person elected accountable. It is not them who is the problem it is US.

Rebellion just for the sake of rebellion? I don't comprehend this. I pay taxes because I want schools, roads, protection, and on and on. yes some of my taxes goes to things I don't like.....but is that a reason to rebel? What is so bad in this country that we need to overthrow the government and start over? What form of government would we put in place? Change change change.....it is all I hear anymore. Change can be for the worse. Change is not always for the better. People have lost respect for other people in our country. Nothing is held sacred anymore. Hey, disagree with the President! That is great! But do we have to disrespect the very OFFICE of President? I don't think so. We don't have to rush to the bottom. Tell the American people HOW you are going to change this or that...don't tell us the other guy is going to take our liberties and destroy the country....I see it now a candidate says "I think taxes should be ___" the other candidate says "see they want to destroy the country" instead of what their plan is.....I am just fed up with it.

I stand by saying this is a great country.....the best. I will defend it no matter the cost. I mean every word of it. Anybody who wants to end this country will have to go through people like me. We don't walk away after being punched...we punch back. There is good in this country. There is kindness. Not everything is crap. We are not barely hanging on. The apocalypse is not upon us. I wish the hyperbole would stop. When there is this much hyperbole then when someone comes along who is truly dangerous no one will listen.

I agree!

 

[swVAHorn]

The executive actions on immigration were shot down today by the Supreme Court. Now I am not going to argue about should they or should they not have went into effect. I am saying if Obama is a Dictator, King, Supreme One, or anything else I have heard on talk radio...how is it possible that he did not make this happen????

 

[LongfellowDrew]

The executive actions on immigration were shot down today by the Supreme Court. Now I am not going to argue about should they or should they not have went into effect. I am saying if Obama is a Dictator, King, Supreme One, or anything else I have heard on talk radio...how is it possible that he did not make this happen????

What's funny is the people that say Obama is a dictator, king etc... are the ones voting for the person (Trump) that THINKS he really is. Ask Scotland about Trump and his ways!

 

[elcapitan009]

What's funny is the people that say Obama is a dictator, king etc... are the ones voting for the person (Trump) that THINKS he really is. Ask Scotland about Trump and his ways!

Well... there is one big difference. (I'm not saying if you don't like Obama, you are a racist. I'm just speaking about those people in that exact situation)

 

[clob94]

The executive actions on immigration were shot down today by the Supreme Court. Now I am not going to argue about should they or should they not have went into effect. I am saying if Obama is a Dictator, King, Supreme One, or anything else I have heard on talk radio...how is it possible that he did not make this happen????

SWVAHORN, I'm not as focused on the executive branch of government as I am on the legislative branch. They've reduced the roll of what was once an honorable position to hold, to something that seems like middle school children in a food fight Both sides, mind you. And what's worse, they're doing WHILE enriching themselves with, what appears to be, little thought of being held legally accountable. Lobbyists, many of whom I consider the scum of the earth, are basically allowed to bribe these elected officials into doing their bidding. Now I KNOW you know that's true. And how many are actually punished for it? Less than 1%?

My point is, if WE did our jobs that way, WE would be fired and prosecuted-- period. You were in the military so I know yoy know at least something about classified information. We both know that if it were YOU under investigation like some politicians are, you'd be pulling a stint in Leavenworth. The same rules don't apply to them. They gerrymandering districts, they take money from special interest groups and call it "campaign funding", they ride on private jets to multi-million dollar resorts paid for by oil companies, or tobacco, or the NRA or whomever. They are very rarely held accountable-- and why?

Fear. They lack fear. From their ivory tower they lack the ability to know what it's like to fear repercussion. I'm sure you've seen the TV series "Scared Straight".... What will it take to "scare" these people into actually doing the right thing for our country-- instead of for themselves. I believe a republic is the best form of government out there- no doubt! But it's only as good as the people in charge of that-- and if you can honestly, honestly, look me on the eyes and tell me that if we made a tweek or two, that our government wouldn't be better off, I don't know what to tell you.
Example-

IF 8 years is long enough for a president, then why not for a congressman? I get Senators have a longer term, but what's so wrong with term limitations? Go to Washington, do your civic duty, then go back to your civilian life. Problem is, they don't WANT to go back, and fight tooth and nail NOT to. Do you honestly think they'll ever pass that? No way in hell. Even if they held a general vote of every American and it passed 3 to 1 in favor, Congress would never impose it. When I speak of tyranny, when I speak of corruption, when I speak of doing the right thing, this is one of my biggest talking points.
And SWVAHORN, I know as a former military man you took an oath. You swore an oath to the American citizens that you would defend the constitution against all enemies both foreign and domestic. How did you feel when you discovered that your emails and phone calls and Google searches were being cataloged without a warrant? That's a violation of the 4th ammendment. And by the way, if you're ever charged with any crime, they're able to take the info that they illegally collected from you and use it to incriminate you. That's a 5th amendment violation.

We know this happened. We know the constitution has been violated by both parties. It's not debatable. All I'm saying is, when we citizens aren't able to hold our elected officials responsible for violating some of the most sacred laws we have, and we have no recourse of action.......... other than a solitary VOTE........ it is a bit depressing.

 

[Belldozer1]

The executive actions on immigration were shot down today by the Supreme Court. Now I am not going to argue about should they or should they not have went into effect. I am saying if Obama is a Dictator, King, Supreme One, or anything else I have heard on talk radio...how is it possible that he did not make this happen????

Because executive order was not an option, it actually had to be voted on this time, that's how.

 

[swVAHorn]

SWVAHORN, I'm not as focused on the executive branch of government as I am on the legislative branch. They've reduced the roll of what was once an honorable position to hold, to something that seems like middle school children in a food fight Both sides, mind you. And what's worse, they're doing WHILE enriching themselves with, what appears to be, little thought of being held legally accountable. Lobbyists, many of whom I consider the scum of the earth, are basically allowed to bribe these elected officials into doing their bidding. Now I KNOW you know that's true. And how many are actually punished for it? Less than 1%?

My point is, if WE did our jobs that way, WE would be fired and prosecuted-- period. You were in the military so I know yoy know at least something about classified information. We both know that if it were YOU under investigation like some politicians are, you'd be pulling a stint in Leavenworth. The same rules don't apply to them. They gerrymandering districts, they take money from special interest groups and call it "campaign funding", they ride on private jets to multi-million dollar resorts paid for by oil companies, or tobacco, or the NBA or whomever. They are very rarely held accountable-- and why?

Fear. They lack fear. From their ivory tower they lack the ability to know what it's like to fear repercussion. I'm sure you've seen the TV series "Scared Straight".... What will it take to "scare" these people into actually doing the right thing for our country-- instead of for themselves. I believe a republic is the best form of government out there- no doubt! But it's only as good as the people in charge of that-- and if you can honestly, honestly, look me on the eyes and tell me that if we made a tweek or two, that our government wouldn't be better off, I don't know what to tell you.
Example-

IF 8 years is long enough for a president, then why not for a congressman? I get Senators have a longer term, but what's so wrong with term limitations? Go to Washington, do your civic duty, then go back to your civilian life. Problem is, they don't WANT to go back, and fight tooth and nail NOT to. Do you honestly think they'll ever pass that? No way in hell. Even if they held a general vote of every American and it passed 3 to 1 in favor, Congress would never impose it. When I speak of tyranny, when I speak of corruption, when I speak of doing the right thing, this is one of my biggest talking points.
And SWVAHORN, I know as a former military man you took an oath. You swore an oath to the American citizens that you would defend the constitution against all enemies both foreign and domestic. How did you feel when you discovered that your emails and phone calls and Google searches were being cataloged without a warrant? That's a violation of the 4th ammendment. And by the way, if you're ever charged with any crime, they're able to take the info that they illegally collected from you and use it to incriminate you. That's a 5th amendment violation.

We know this happened. We know the constitution has been violated by both parties. It's not debatable. All I'm saying is, when we citizens aren't able to hold our elected officials responsible for violating some of the most sacred laws we have, and we have no recourse of action.......... other than a solitary VOTE........ it is a bit depressing.

I can't disagree with anything you have said Clob. The government is not perfect. Some of them get by with some things that they shouldn't. But do they do enough bad to overthrow the government? Not in my view. People with money and power ALWAYS get by with more than us peasants. I agree about term limits and the whole 9 yards except the tyranny part. I don't think we live under tyranny. A republic is the best form of government. I just think we are blaming the wrong people....why would they do right if WE let them get by with it by voting them IN? See? We got to vote them out and get people in that think like us instead of voting for OUR TEAM. WE the people need to show them they can be replaced. Every government in the history of mankind has done things wrong. The people have to use their power of numbers and hold the ELECTED officials accountable. A solitary vote could mean the person is elected or not.

 

[swVAHorn]

SWVAHORN, I'm not as focused on the executive branch of government as I am on the legislative branch. They've reduced the roll of what was once an honorable position to hold, to something that seems like middle school children in a food fight Both sides, mind you. And what's worse, they're doing WHILE enriching themselves with, what appears to be, little thought of being held legally accountable. Lobbyists, many of whom I consider the scum of the earth, are basically allowed to bribe these elected officials into doing their bidding. Now I KNOW you know that's true. And how many are actually punished for it? Less than 1%?

My point is, if WE did our jobs that way, WE would be fired and prosecuted-- period. You were in the military so I know yoy know at least something about classified information. We both know that if it were YOU under investigation like some politicians are, you'd be pulling a stint in Leavenworth. The same rules don't apply to them. They gerrymandering districts, they take money from special interest groups and call it "campaign funding", they ride on private jets to multi-million dollar resorts paid for by oil companies, or tobacco, or the NRA or whomever. They are very rarely held accountable-- and why?

Fear. They lack fear. From their ivory tower they lack the ability to know what it's like to fear repercussion. I'm sure you've seen the TV series "Scared Straight".... What will it take to "scare" these people into actually doing the right thing for our country-- instead of for themselves. I believe a republic is the best form of government out there- no doubt! But it's only as good as the people in charge of that-- and if you can honestly, honestly, look me on the eyes and tell me that if we made a tweek or two, that our government wouldn't be better off, I don't know what to tell you.
Example-

IF 8 years is long enough for a president, then why not for a congressman? I get Senators have a longer term, but what's so wrong with term limitations? Go to Washington, do your civic duty, then go back to your civilian life. Problem is, they don't WANT to go back, and fight tooth and nail NOT to. Do you honestly think they'll ever pass that? No way in hell. Even if they held a general vote of every American and it passed 3 to 1 in favor, Congress would never impose it. When I speak of tyranny, when I speak of corruption, when I speak of doing the right thing, this is one of my biggest talking points.
And SWVAHORN, I know as a former military man you took an oath. You swore an oath to the American citizens that you would defend the constitution against all enemies both foreign and domestic. How did you feel when you discovered that your emails and phone calls and Google searches were being cataloged without a warrant? That's a violation of the 4th ammendment. And by the way, if you're ever charged with any crime, they're able to take the info that they illegally collected from you and use it to incriminate you. That's a 5th amendment violation.

We know this happened. We know the constitution has been violated by both parties. It's not debatable. All I'm saying is, when we citizens aren't able to hold our elected officials responsible for violating some of the most sacred laws we have, and we have no recourse of action.......... other than a solitary VOTE........ it is a bit depressing.

The posts that you make always make sense....even ones I don't agree with 100% at least you think for yourself and you are not led around by your nose.....you are a smart dude for sure. I like when you spell things out like in this post. It gives all of us an idea of how other people think a situation all the way through. Even when people don't see it exactly the same we can understand where the other one is coming from. Now if and I mean if our government ever does become tyrannical I will be right beside you fighting against it.

 

[oldhorn2]

I agree with term limits for congressmen and senators..give em each 6 years to serve and then send a bus over and haul every last one of them to prison....there wont be an innocent man in the bunch.