Thought provoking article on the horizon for the BigXII and possible growth

I am disappointed that UT and A&M made him choose his religion or sports. I doubt he is the first or last Morman that has happened to.
 
I am not misguided. The scholarship must be guaranteed for 4 years. A provision exists, that a student remains enrolled at the University despite not taking classes. I know, because individuals in the Armed Forces deploy for a year or more and do not have to apply for readmission to the University. They are not required to take classes while away, and this provision is not exclusive to the Armed Forces.
 
I am disappointed that UT and A&M made him choose his religion or sports. I doubt he is the first or last Morman that has happened to.
Well when we fire coaches for winning 8 games instead of 10 games that might explain why they make those decisions. If indeed that happens. We as fans, media, boosters etc are mostly to blame for stuff like that.
 
Paperwork must be completed and the scholarship is guaranteed once the athlete returns from mission. It happens, BYU does it, so doubt the truth all you want.
 
Let me first say I have no problem with Christians and actually have toured a Morman temple. It's a bit different let me tell ya. With that said I don't see the problem here. We are talking about an athletic conference no one is saying you have to go to Morman mass or whatever they call it. As far as "sharing money with the Mormon church". When you see the check you'll get over it.

I'd also tell baylor and TCU both look the lack of a championship game has screwed you 2 years in a row we can add BYU or we can stay at 10. Texas, OU and probably OSU can make it without the game. You probably can't. Let's not make this about religion because it has nothing to do with anything.

Now if not BYU there are some other teams
Cincinnati, Boise state, maybe someone like Utah state. A lot of "mid major" type programs that want and could play at the higher level.

BYU, Cincy, and any other "second 5 conference" will not significantly raise the per school payout. It would either stay the same or drop. That's one reason why there are member institutions in the Big 12 that are ok with staying at 10. Another reason is OU made the playoffs. A one loss conference champion made it. The difference between this year and last year is OU's strength of schedule was much better than Baylor and TCU and the Big 12 was stupid in not naming Baylor the champion instead of that stupid co champs thing.
 
UT is not a religious school. In fact, UT is quite the opposite.
That's incorrect. Being neutral on religion is not the opposite of being religious.

I haven't read that Baylor or TCU object to the dififfetence in religious standards among the current Big 12 schools. I have no reason to hypothesize they would start now.
Maybe, maybe not. There are no competing other religions in the conference currently among member schools so you really can't say.
 
BYU, Cincy, and any other "second 5 conference" will not significantly raise the per school payout. It would either stay the same or drop. That's one reason why there are member institutions in the Big 12 that are ok with staying at 10. Another reason is OU made the playoffs. A one loss conference champion made it. The difference between this year and last year is OU's strength of schedule was much better than Baylor and TCU and the Big 12 was stupid in not naming Baylor the champion instead of that stupid co champs thing.
And the big 12 has only themselves to blame for that. There was a path to expanding the conference, and the paycheck. The big 12 chose not to get on that train, and lost out. So if they want to expand they'll just have to take the best markets they can and there will be more money both in TV and the title game. Is it going to be the massive paycheck they could of got? No but it will be more. This moaning about not wanting to share money with him because whatever should stop.
 
Prove me wrong. I am open to it. So far, my facts are all we have to work with.
Prove you wrong about what? That UT is not anti-religion? You can't prove a negative. You made an assertion that UT makes players choose between religion and sports and used a single example to try and back that up. You made the assertion. You back it up.

And "facts" about what? That your buddy didn't get a scholarship?
 
I gave an example of how UT made a player choose between his religion and a UT scholarship. All I read from you is maybes, ifs, and opinions. Where are your facts? The opposite of religion is no religion or antireligion. It's not that hard to figure out. There is no neutral.
 
I said there's no policy at UT of being anti-religion. That is a fact, your subjective take on a friend's situation notwithstanding. And no, if a school doesn't have a religious affiliation that doesn't mean it's "anti-religion". That's ludicrous.
 
You trying to extrapolate a university policy from a single situation also doesn't hold any water.
 
I never said there was a policy that specifically said it was antireligious. That would be a dumb move for any university. It is anti-Mormon to not honor a players scholarship while they are on mission.
 
The ACLU recently defended a Mormon student's religious rights in West Virginia for this very act. The Mormon student completed his freshman year and filed paperwork with the scholarship board to hold his scholly while away on mission. They denied it. Now, they are going to court.
 
http://www.americangap.org/fav-colleges.php Here is a source. It refers to the time off as gap years, not specific to religion. UT and A&M aren't on the list. The value of the list is to notice that , as of 2013-2014, some universites honored the admission and scholarship. Others do not.
Ok so your unofficial, informal survey that may or may not have even included UT and which doesn't refer to religion is a source backing up your claim that UT is anti-religious. Gotcha.
 
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It is anti-Mormon to not honor a players scholarship while they are on mission.
Or it is a faulty assumption that your buddy got passed over because of his religion simply because there was another dude who could play right away.
 
How many Mormon football players have played on scholarship at UT, went on a 1-year mission, and had their scholarships honored upon return?
 
Don't know. How many Mormons attend UT in general? How many Buddhist UT players have there been? Hindus? Guess UT is against them too.
 
Scholz, you can assume away. I know what happened. I was there. That is not generalizing. He had to make a choice due to his religion. All the coaches were aware. He was offered for football and track. He chose BYU because they honored his scholarship after his religious mission. Speculate on depth chart of the football and track teams. That's all you got.
 
Scholz, why are you so defensive? It's a conversation. I can see you are emotional. We should stop here. You have a position and so do I. Neither of us will convince the other to budge. Good night and God Bless you Scholz!
 
Not assuming anything. It's a fact that UT doesn't discriminate in terms of religion. You're the one trying to paint with a huge brush based on a single biased personal experience. If he didn't want to play or wasn't available to play for whatever reason, and some equally talented guy did and could, then the other guy probably got the spot. It's not supernatural and not some imaginary and baseless religious persecution.
 
Scholz, why are you so defensive? It's a conversation. I can see you are emotional. We should stop here. You have a position and so do I. Neither of us will convince the other to budge. Good night and God Bless you Scholz!
I don't like UT being painted as anti-religious completely falsely. Don't lie about my university. I also am very tired of religious fanatics claiming imaginary persecutions at every turn. The laughable, annual, supposed "War on Christmas" comes to mind. And lastly because religion isn't allowed to be stuffed down everyone else's throat doesn't mean those others are anti-religious. Sheesh.
 
I'm sure many of you are aware, Mormans are required to go on a mission, while in college. This causes Mormans to miss 1 year of school and sports. BYU is the only university that honors all Mormon scholarships, even while they are on mission. My high school buddy had offers from UT and A&M for football and track. But, they would not give him a full-ride if he honored his religion and went on mission. So, he honored his religion and went to BYU. I am proud of him for sticking to his beliefs. I am also disappointed in schools like UT and A&M that force you to choose sports or continuing your religious practice.

Actually, they aren't required to go on missions, it's the kids choice. Living in Utah for several years, I learned a thing or two about Mormons. One of my BYU friends told me that none of their great QBs ever went on a mission. I found that pretty interesting.

BTW Why would TCU not want to be in the same conference as BYU since they were both in the MWC just a few years ago.

Back in 2007 I went to the BYU TCU game in Provo. It was weird, almost aggsy weird, but much more pleasant as no one was drunk and they didn't slobber all over each other when BYU scored a TD.
 
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Heathen persecutors in Austin. lulz.

ut2.jpg
 
I assumed the comments about TCU and Baylor were accurate. Maybe it is unfair because I have nothing valid for which to base that assumption. I am a Christian and proud of it. But, I have to say I know I have seen how pastors and religious leadership get towards different faiths. I don't have enough knowledge to argue any other doctrine, but I just don't care whether somebody is catholic, non-denominational, baptist or mormon...
 
That's a bit strong isn't it? Seems to me he was anti-religious bigotry against Mormonism in the context of a football conference. If you equate that with being anti-Christian, then that might be telling.

BTW, I think Cal objected to Baylor's inclusion in a potential merger with the PAC a few years back. Same kind of religious bigotry.
"Why would anyone give an F about their religious objections ..." I assumed the "F" as indicator of an anti -Christian viewpoint. Maybe I'm wrong. Regardless, you raise a valid point on me - Jesus questioned how I can see the speck in my neighbor's eye when there is a log in my own eye.
My only point is --- this thread has gotten way out of hand, based on the premise that Baylor and TCU would object to BYU joining the conference. But no one has pointed to a source, credible or not, that they would object, other than generalizations that pastors are anti-Mormon. Enough of this speculation. Its time to celebrate a Baylor Bowl win! Who needs Seth Russell!
 
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Baylor could care less about BYU being Mormans.

Honestly there are two problems with BYU.

1. The olympic sports we all play on Sunday
They want allow it. You talking baseball and women's basketball for example.

2. They are as arrogant and controlling as UT. I don't believe the rest of the conferance could stomach two of you. Now that is the truth!
 
There's nothing that could have been done four years ago that would have made any meaningful difference in the conference's long-term viability.


I don't buy that. That is the agenda they sold us.

But the reason that is, is they weren't trying to be proactive. The powers that be were being reactive. And that was the biggest failure of all. Especially when every other conference got very proactive and starting poaching, we became the sitting duck. They made that our reality.

Had they been proactive and made moves first, FSU/Clemson and many other attractive options were on the table. Can you say Notre Dame? Its not like ND went to the weak ACC and the BigXII could have woo'd them or anything. Hell they could have simply kept some of what was here by reworking things. Instead they let teams leave. Thought we could survive as a 10 team league. And they arrogantly thought the bottom line would be just as profitable. And they thought it could thrive. Then more teams left and they were screwed trying to scramble to make it back to 10. At that point, they still had top options who were sniffing, but yes you are right they were not begging and it was a tough sell by then. And that is when they sold you the agenda you are buying. But even then BYU/Cincy/others were an option. They just felt it better to stay at 10 with TCU and WVU.

And they are now admitting they were wrong to do that and are looking too late to add. The options are less today, than they were back then.
 
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Enough of this speculation. Its time to celebrate a Baylor Bowl win! Who needs Seth Russell!
Congrats on your win. Just shows what a good coach Briles is to put that good of an offense together in short order with a lack of a passing game. To quote an old coach Bum Phillips, "He can take his'n and beat your'n and take your'n and beat his'n".

"Why would anyone give an F about their religious objections ..." I assumed the "F" as indicator of an anti -Christian viewpoint. Maybe I'm wrong.
Another viewpoint is that he didn't want religious objections keeping us from improving the conference. I would submit that not wanting religion imposed on you is not the same thing as being against that religion. People just want others to keep it to themselves.
 
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BYU...

2. They are as arrogant and controlling as UT. I don't believe the rest of the conferance could stomach two of you. Now that is the truth!
Uh oh. Somebody better call the Waaaaaambulance.
 
BYU-"No drinking, no dancing, no sex, etc"...which makes them even more dangerous.

Somehow BYU starts 22yr old freshman plus they have an "in" to several Somoian areas and are nationally recognized vs Cinci.

BYU would be a strong addition, not so sure about Cinci. Surely there is another team out there the Big XII can pick up that tops Cinci.