Thought provoking article on the horizon for the BigXII and possible growth

[jsto60]

http://www.campusrush.com/big-12-conference-questions-future-expansion-1528668401.html


For those in places like OK that have an aversion to reading, the basic idea is that an important vote is coming up for the BigXII. The conferences will decide if the 10 team conference will be allowed to have a CC game. The BigXII admits that not having a 13th data point aka CC game, is a disadvantage. If the vote on Jan15th allows the BigXII to have this game with only 10 teams....the conference will likely stay the same. If not, the conference most likely will expand within a year or two.

It proposes that as we sit today, BYU and Cincy are the most likely adds.

Another school in the B1G has added a provision that says even if the 10 team conf thing is added, they must have divisions with division winners playing each other....that way the CC game is not manipulated (they are worried about the ACC doing something strange and are also trying to make things harder on the BigXII who never helped them out when they were a 10 team league)

 

[speedstrength]

Baylor and TCU would make it very difficult for BYU to join the conference. The other problem is that they don't bring much value in terms of TV markets and the TV money split would go way down.

 

[jsto60]

I didn't say I'd pick BYU. This was what the article suggested is the most likely scenario given the pulse.

BYU keeps being pointed to as THE team the BigXII wants most and they have for years now. Add in that they also have a want to join a major conf now after seeing Indy status not work out.

As for TV. Of course splitting things 10 ways vs 12 ways seems on the surface to bring in less $. But remember with more teams and wider TV markets, the TV deal will eventually grow. And more importantly the BigXII allows for 3rd party TV rights, which some of the revenue has to be split amongst the other teams. So BYUs own network would add revenue and enlarge pie it is also taking a piece out of.

 

[speedstrength]

The people that wrote the artlice are just looking at the best available teams and throwing them out there. The fact that BYU is basically an arm of the Mormon Church is a deal breaker for Baylor and TCU. They don't want the TV money going to support the Mormon Church. BYU made more sense than WVU last round but they weren't even considered by the powers that be.

 

[clob94]

Agreed. Baylor and TCU will throw fits over the mormons.

So much for the Christian thing to do..........

 

[Brentwood Sooner]

If the big 12 adds them 2 scrubs OU needs to get out ASAP. Those teams bring nothing to the table and big 12 already made a mistake taking in WVU

 

[diadevic]

Agreed. Baylor and TCU will throw fits over the mormons.

So much for the Christian thing to do..........

Why do you say that? I have read or seen nothing which indicates Baylor opposes BYU.

 

[bubba2023]

Not that I would want to add BYU, but the conference would need to put Baylor and TCU in their place if they think anyone gives a F about their religious objections in the context of conference expansion.

 

[diadevic]

Not that I would want to add BYU, but the conference would need to put Baylor and TCU in their place if they think anyone gives a F about their religious objections in the context of conference expansion.

Again, I ask -- who is objecting? I don't know why this board is a forum for your anti-Christian viewpoints based on speculation of an objection to expansion based solely on religious views. I got no problem with BYU. Cincy, on the other hand, would weaken the conference.

 

[BringBackRoyal]

I can't wait for us to get out of this dump of a conference.

 

[RealBear]

I can't wait for us to get out of this dump of a conference.

Now that's funny, coming from you.

So really, the biggest disappointment in the Big 12 is THE UNIVERSITY OF TEXAS.

Refute that! The fact your program is so far down has nothing to do with the value of the Big12. The LHN and arrogance plus hiring poor incompetent coaches plus bad recruiting is your problem, not Baylor, OU, OKST, TT, KST,WV AND TCU!

Fix UT and improve the neighborhood, how about it!

 

[4MNChampsHorn]

I'm a graduate of UT and I will graduate from Baylor in 2016. I am sick of UT fans ragging on Christians. I am sick of watching UT lose. Right now, Baylor and TCU have better football teams than UT, as judged by their season records. UT needs to fix their team before concerning themselves with assumptions about the desires of Baylor and TCU.

 

[BringBackRoyal]

I'm aware that our program is down (though the LHN really has nothing to do with it). That's not really news to anyone.

I'm also aware that this conference is a demographic loser with no realistic possibilities for improvement, and that it's doomed to a terrible TV deal in the next round of negotiations. Whether or not our program is in good shape is irrelevant. The conference is a dump, and we should have bailed on it four years ago. We definitely need to take advantage of our next opportunity.

 

[bubba2023]

Again, I ask -- who is objecting? I don't know why this board is a forum for your anti-Christian viewpoints based on speculation of an objection to expansion based solely on religious views. I got no problem with BYU. Cincy, on the other hand, would weaken the conference.

Didn't mean it as a verification that they are objecting. Just speaking from a general sense that TCU and Baylor's religious stances shouldn't be in the discussion when talking about conference expansion.

 

[HornosaurusRex]

So really, the biggest disappointment in the Big 12 is THE UNIVERSITY OF TEXAS.

Refute that!

Ok.

Hook 'em

 

[Scholz]

So really, the biggest disappointment in the Big 12 is THE UNIVERSITY OF TEXAS.

Really? We've won national championships in football and baseball recently as well as football BCS games. How about you? Maybe win something significant on the national stage for the first time in history before talking down to us, real whiner.

Oh and scoreboard. Go cry a little.

 

[clob94]

Why do you say that? I have read or seen nothing which indicates Baylor opposes BYU.

I have several Baylor friends and a couple of TCU friends that are very involved with their respective universities and I've asked the same question before.

The answer I get is "well.....you know...... they're Mormon. There are elements there that we don't condone......"Usually something to the effect. I usually just shrug and let sleeping dogs lie. I did, however, choose to engage once and my retort was "It's not very Christian to judge.... you know, judge not lest ye be judged...".....

 

[HornosaurusRex]

No drinking, no dancing, no sex, etc...

Seems like Baylor/TCU would welcome a school with shared conservative attitudes as compared to another Sodom and Gomorrah, but regardless they're two votes out of ten, so I dont think they're going to decide what's best for the conference.

That said, the ship has sailed on the best options to expand... so in the end [which will be when the tv contract and signing of rights agreement expires in 2025], I think it's for naught.

Hook 'em

 

[jsto60]

The people that wrote the artlice are just looking at the best available teams and throwing them out there. The fact that BYU is basically an arm of the Mormon Church is a deal breaker for Baylor and TCU. They don't want the TV money going to support the Mormon Church. BYU made more sense than WVU last round but they weren't even considered by the powers that be.

Never seen BU or TCU say that.

Also last time BYU themselves wanted to go Independent. And now that isn't working out for them.


This really doesn't have to do with religion. It is TV sets. Same reason UT won't let UH in. They don't gain any TV sets that way in the Houston market which already watches, and they don't want to strengthen a commuter school. They've kept UH out notoriously for a while. Its about $, not TV.

 

[Scholz]

I don't know why this board is a forum for your anti-Christian viewpoints...

That's a bit strong isn't it? Seems to me he was anti-religious bigotry against Mormonism in the context of a football conference. If you equate that with being anti-Christian, then that might be telling.

BTW, I think Cal objected to Baylor's inclusion in a potential merger with the PAC a few years back. Same kind of religious bigotry.

 

[speedstrength]

Presidents, Chancellors and Boards of Regents are the ones that have the say in expansion. The concern was would the money be used to upgrade facilities or would the money be used to support the Mormon Church. I'm not getting into here but if you are interested you can google Southern Baptist Convention and Mormon and see why Baylor wouldn't be all to keen to bring BYU on board.

 

[jsto60]

I'm aware that our program is down (though the LHN really has nothing to do with it). That's not really news to anyone.

I'm also aware that this conference is a demographic loser with no realistic possibilities for improvement, and that it's doomed to a terrible TV deal in the next round of negotiations. Whether or not our program is in good shape is irrelevant. The conference is a dump, and we should have bailed on it four years ago. We definitely need to take advantage of our next opportunity.

No, we should have proactively helped to strengthen the conf years ago. Or at least the Pres of the BigXII should have.

UT should be looking out for what makes UT better. The conf should be doing the same. It became a dump thanks to the conf Pres not looking out for the conf, but instead for a few teams interests.

 

[4MNChampsHorn]

I've read no legitimate source to back up the comments toward Baylor/TCU. I see vague comments and feelings from posters that grow into accusations.

UT is not a religious school. In fact, UT is quite the opposite. I haven't read that Baylor or TCU object to the dififfetence in religious standards among the current Big 12 schools. I have no reason to hypothesize they would start now.

 

[Son of Wasatch]

Baylor and TCU would make it very difficult for BYU to join the conference. The other problem is that they don't bring much value in terms of TV markets and the TV money split would go way down.

If we added BYU they would bring the biggest TV market outside of Texas to the Big 12. This conference is in dire need of TV presents outside of the state of Texas.

The people that wrote the artlice are just looking at the best available teams and throwing them out there. The fact that BYU is basically an arm of the Mormon Church is a deal breaker for Baylor and TCU. They don't want the TV money going to support the Mormon Church. BYU made more sense than WVU last round but they weren't even considered by the powers that be.

Since when do we care what Baylor and TCU think? What are they going to do, leave the conference if the Big 12 adds BYU? there are something like 10 million Mormons living in the US and if just half of them follow BYU, it would be great for the conference to bring them in.

There is only one deal breaker when it comes to BYU and that is their attitude about playing on Sunday. What is funny is Baylor and TCU have no problem about breaking that commandment about keeping Sunday holy, I guess maybe they could learn a thing or two from BYU.

 

[BringBackRoyal]

No, we should have proactively helped to strengthen the conf years ago. Or at least the Pres of the BigXII should have.

UT should be looking out for what makes UT better. The conf should be doing the same. It became a dump thanks to the conf Pres not looking out for the conf, but instead for a few teams interests.

There's nothing that could have been done four years ago that would have made any meaningful difference in the conference's long-term viability.

Honestly, there's nothing that could have been done to keep the conference together permanently; at best, we're talking about buying a few extra years of apparent stability. After the ACC carved up the Big East, the Big 12 was the demographic weakling of the P5 -- with the least attractive possibilities for expansion (DeLoss's ND pipe dream aside) -- and thus the obvious next candidate for the chopping block whenever the demographically more well-endowed conferences decided they were ready to expand. Getting lost in the particulars and the finger-pointing is to miss the bigger picture. I remember talking with people back in 2004 and 2005 about how the explosion of money in CFB made the dissolution of the Big 12 an eventual inevitability; it was pretty clear even then if you were looking at the most relevant factors.

 

[4MNChampsHorn]

Wasatch, could you imagine what would happen to football and the economy if Christians decided not to work on Sunday's? I pray they would. Could you imagine if all Christians voted every election and according to the Bible? I pray they would.

 

[Scholz]

BYU is to Mormons what ND is to Catholics. They would bring nothing but tv sets. There are reportedly over 6 million Mormons in this country.

 

[4MNChampsHorn]

I am Christian Evangelical and one of my best high school friends (on the football team) was Morman. He went on to play football and throw shotput & discus at BYU (on scholly).

 

[speedstrength]

If we added BYU they would bring the biggest TV market outside of Texas to the Big 12. This conference is in dire need of TV presents outside of the state of Texas.



Since when do we care what Baylor and TCU think? What are they going to do, leave the conference if the Big 12 adds BYU? there are something like 10 million Mormons living in the US and if just half of them follow BYU, it would be great for the conference to bring them in.

There is only one deal breaker when it comes to BYU and that is their attitude about playing on Sunday. What is funny is Baylor and TCU have no problem about breaking that commandment about keeping Sunday holy, I guess maybe they could learn a thing or two from BYU.

Can't find the Bylaws but I believe right now its 8 votes (80%) to add a new member. I am pretty confident they wouldn't get votes from TCU or Baylor. I am also pretty sure that WVU wouldn't be to happy about the travel especially for the non revenue sports.

 

[4MNChampsHorn]

I'm sure many of you are aware, Mormans are required to go on a mission, while in college. This causes Mormans to miss 1 year of school and sports. BYU is the only university that honors all Mormon scholarships, even while they are on mission. My high school buddy had offers from UT and A&M for football and track. But, they would not give him a full-ride if he honored his religion and went on mission. So, he honored his religion and went to BYU. I am proud of him for sticking to his beliefs. I am also disappointed in schools like UT and A&M that force you to choose sports or continuing your religious practice.