Yes there a lot of "what if's" in that game but simply stated, our defense held them to USC to 17 points in regulation, yes, USC. With just half our normal offensive production we win that game.
Ketch's 10 Thoughts From the Weekend (I'm not talking about quarterbacks... just kidding)
- Thread starter Ketchum
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Yes there a lot of "what if's" in that game but simply stated, our defense held them to USC to 17 points in regulation, yes, USC. With just half our normal offensive production we win that game.
19 of 36 for 245 yards, 3 TD, 1 INT, 131.9 game rating, 60.3 adjusted QBR
He was solid in that game, but far from very good. Having Foreman rush for 150+ and 2 touchdowns sure as shit helped.
Both of these quarterbacks are screwed from a running game/offensive line support stand point.
Colt versus Nebraska B12 Championship 2009 - Tucker hits the game winning field goal. Suh was a manimal that game.
Last time he played on the road, he was hurt, playing for shithead coaches, for a lost cause season and he was still a true freshman.
"...unless we're talking about marginal results..." is kind of an awkward phrase to use when the question is asking for a binary answer. Is it a stretch to say Shane would have played better than [pretty badly]? The answer is "No, it's not a stretch."
I usually think you get unfairly pegged as an arguer, but come on brother... You would argue, that it's a stretch to think Shane would have passed better than Sam for the first 3 quarters? I don't think you would make that statement unless you were just dead set on winning every single argument.
Maybe and besides Maryland we played would have beaten USC. I'm not so sure Maryland isn't a lot better than we think they are. We'll find out in a couple of weeks when they play tOSU.
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they did have a kickoff out of bounds and 15 yard penalty to help on that drive. The 15 yard penalty practically put them in field goal range.
If Kingsbury and Beaty both get fired at the end of the year we should hire both of them and let them run the offense next year.
This is a great point. I think it's the dilemma that CTH is facing. Do I play it safe with Shane and his limited ability to run (he can run but can he stay healthy) or do I play Sam and gamble on him and his higher upside while risking the TF mistakes we saw against USC (4 turnovers). Tough call but Herman likes to gamble and we will see how things unfold. I personally would like to see Sam continue to start and get the in game experience he's lacking.
Agree. At least we found out this team has some "dog" in it and it was awesome to finally see them play that hard. We should have won that game.....we still have lots of bonehead players that make really stupid mistakes that help us beat ourselves.......untimely penalties, etc.....poor play calling and crap officiating.
Forget last year. This is now and the last few minutes of any game can be critical if you don't score much throughout the rest of the game. Do I see this right....Shane has to score on the first two drives of the game against Iowa State or else Sam should take over ? That is just incredible logic to me. I have never seen that applied to any QB before and the bias is just overwhelming. Coach Herman needs to start Shane and stick with him as long as he is healthy. We need consistency and Shane gives us that.
But it's a logical fallacy to assert that because the last time it happened at Texas the qb was an All-American, it means that the qb that did it this time was performing at an All-American level. It's a non sequitor.
I was there and although there were a lot of Horns in the crowd, unless they were wearing red the crowd was still about 70-30. Maybe 65-45. USC definitely had the advantage, but it was a nice showing for a road game half way cross the country.
Taking a time out from QB talk:
- Herman needs to kick that FG
- We got screwed by the referees on at least 2 obvious DPI calls
- Malik plays better in coverage on passing downs than blitzing. USC was the first time I've seen him blitz successfully. But he's really good spying QB's and against the run.
- Buy/Sell question: Is Devin Duvernay the walking epitome of a sophomore slump? He's making John Burt's soph season look like a success.
- Was the attendance and electricity of the USC game evidence that we need to reconsider the Pac 12 as a future conference landing spot?
- I'm a firm believer that Texas has the hottest female fans (apologies to USC and Ole Miss) so why in the world couldn't we find some better looking representatives for Tom Rinaldi's NYC fan bar segment?
- It warmed my heart to see all the VY love this weekend.
Compared to Sams 27.4 QBR in this game, that is pretty damn good. Although I actually agree that neither QB is ready or should be the one being relied upon for Texas.
That game also wasn't a road game or a first road game, but it is it's own animal, for sure.
The larger most important point is that we're talking about 6's and maybe 6.5s. The bigger picture matters in this conversation and there are so many unknown variables to be emphatic about anything.
I think this is an understated factor in the Shane vs. Sam debate. You can argue about who throws the better ball, who runs better, who has better vision, etc., but another factor is which QB does the team rally around better. Watching the game and the emotion in the huddle, it seems as though the team fights harder for Sam.
The scarcity of such a moment actually supports my point that for those five minutes, Sam performed like an ace.
Those moments, when they happen, are the things of legend.
And that's as close to getting you to concede a point as I was hoping to get!
I'll be honest, Monday's generally suck but reading TTFTW is one of the best part's of the day. Thanks for the discussion.
Those 5 minutes, I was thinking about renaming my 15 year to Sam.
You're right about Iowa State, Ketch. This is the pivotal game of the season. Win, and move on to bigger and better things. Lose, and find yourself facing a long season without any momentum working for you. And once again, so sorry to lose Sean Adams. I know he was a dear friend of yours. Very tough to lose a buddy.
I just read 6 pages of this thread and one thing is abundantly clear - Ketch's agenda on the QB situation. I especially enjoy the patronizing tone to which he replies to any that disagree as well as the argument of "one of us is a fanatic and one of us is an unbiased observer". Classic Ketch. Completely insufferable at times when he sees an opportunity to throw gasoline on any minor controversy with the Texas football program. It's a wonder why people call this program a cesspool..
Nope, the natives would be questioning the hiring of TH had we been blown out. Thankfully, one of his coordinators earned their paycheck.
Major Applewhite on the against highly ranked Nebraska in 1998, Mack Brown's 1st season.
VY had more comeback victories than any QB in college football, but he'd usually win with his legs and have come from behind blowouts like against Ok St twice. VY did take down Kansas on the road with a last second TD pass but KU wasn't ranked.
When has Shane ever demonstrated he can escape the pocket and make big plays downfield? Last season and against Maryland when Shane did manage to avoid the sack he'd have to run for his life just to throw it away.
Put Shane behind a great O-line with an established running game and he can be highly effective. The question is, can Shane be effective on THIS TEAM with its wounded OL (AA LT now injured) and no running game to rely upon? Shane is a more accurate passer, no question. But he wouldn't have been able to scramble and make great plays down the field against USC like Sam did. So the question is, can Shane be effective against Iowa State? Will our running game and OL pass protection improve so he has ample time to read the D and throw? I think so. But to take down big time opponents like OU, Ok St and TCU we're probably gonna need our feisty, fearless, mobile freshman at QB.
