I thought Major would be great... eventually.
Hmmmm.... Hutzler was better than I thought he'd be.
Let me think on it.
Ketch's 10 Thoughts From The Weekend (Grading the Hires and so much more)
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Hmmmm.... Hutzler was better than I thought he'd be.
Let me think on it.
Flood was at Rutgers for 10 years and had 3 OL drafted during that time. He was 27-24 as the Rutgers HC with virtually all of those wins against non P5 schools. He was fired in 2015 after a 4-8 season and a TON of off-field incidents. Was fired (with SS) in Atlanta after 2 years where their offense was ranked 27th in the league in rushing and the team went 7-9 and "struggled to make adjustments in the NFL and score in the red zone" (he was an assistant OL coach for the Falcons). Off to Bama for polishing.
As for Banks, a couple of 5 stars for a money rich SEC school does not a recruiting master make. Hey, but I guess he's good at building relationships (which is the first I've ever heard that about a coach).
I've been sitting in the stands for 30 years...I hope it works out more than most but I've seen this dog and pony show before so I'll take the wait and see approach and look forward to the avalanche of recruits that have diverted from Alabama and are on the way.
He‘s right that it was national, and it was the Monday night Game of the Week. Explains how I saw it live on TV as a kid in Iowa at the time.
I think context matters. At a bottom feeder school that was barely clinging to D1 status for a while, he cranked out more NFL drafted players than Texas has with similarly ranked players in the last 30 years or so.
He won eight games in one season and nine games in the first year in the Big 10. At Rutgers.
Again, context matters.
Correct. It got out of control in that final season, which is why he lost his job. It doesn't change the fact that he literally won 8 games the year before.
They beat Washington State, Michigan, Indiana, Maryland and North Carolina, so no... the majority of those wins were not against non-power five schools.
The fact that he got the head coaching job as a non-coordinator tight end coach speaks to how he was viewed with regards to recruiting and importance on the staff. Those types of hires rarely happen.
Are really pinning anything related to the 2017 Falcons on him inside of his role as assistant offensive line coach? NFL teams and locker rooms are super complicated. He was with a Falcons team that lost the Super Bowl in 2015, made another run in 2016 and fell off a cliff in 2017. This ain't college ball.
Is Kevin Sumlin being polished right now at Alabama? Is that what we're really doing?
Before his arrival, how many out of state five star quarterbacks had Texas A&M ever landed? I'll hand up and listen.
What is it that you actually believe is going to happen? You seem to be pussyfooting around with a statement, but I can't quite make it out. What dog and pony show have you seen before? Use specific examples.
(Old guy voice that I use to irritate my kids) Damn right - you had 4 channels to watch on TV - if you were lucky! You got one college football game on Saturday - and you were grateful! You didn’t see all of the NFL highlights until MNF halftime - and you didn’t even mind that Howard Cosell showed them to you. And you had to walk to school 5 miles uphill in the snow both ways...
When people say things like Flood failed in the NFL because the Falcons sucked and they got fired.... understand there's zero nuance to that position.
For instance, sometimes a 10-6 team becomes a non-playoff team and everyone gets fired because of uncontrollable shit like this.
For instance, sometimes a 10-6 team becomes a non-playoff team and everyone gets fired because of uncontrollable shit like this.
I didn't realize you were such an old ****er.(Old guy voice that I use to irritate my kids) Damn right - you had 4 channels to watch on TV - if you were lucky! You got one college football game on Saturday - and you were grateful! You didn’t see all of the NFL highlights until MNF halftime - and you didn’t even mind that Howard Cosell showed them to you. And you had to walk to school 5 miles uphill in the snow both ways...
If that conversation was about the Aaron 715 home run, absolutely it was seen live by the entire country.
It was so awesome.
I agree with all of that. When I looked at the recruiting scores Ketch gave, it kind of stood out that our top 3 recruiters (including Sark) are all offensive guys.
Personally I think the Choate guy is going to be a superstar recruiter based on his experience as a head coach and the way that his players talked about him after he left. Wouldn't surprise me if he is a top 2 recruiter on staff a year from now.
Yep!
I saw the Stones Tattoo You at the Cotton Bowl in 1981, a few Texxas Jams, and Van Halen Diver Down at Reunion in 1983- I promise they were all every bit as fun as Queen in their prime!
As a HC, Flood was 9-15 against P5 schools. Of those 9 wins, 5 were against basketball schools (Indiana x 2, Maryland, North Carolina, and Kansas), crappy Washington State and Arkansas (x 2) teams and his big signature win against Michigan. He was 18-9 against non P5 so only 33% of his wins were against the big boys so yes Ketch, the majority of his wins were not P5. As a HC in the B10 he was 3-5 in conference in 2014 and 1-7 in conference in 2015. Whoopie!
Flood wasn't hired by the Falcons until after the 2017 Super Bowl (2016 season) so not sure what you're talking about.... Regardless, I have no idea how his time at Atlanta went for him and the specific circumstances, other then he got shit-canned with SS after that went south after 2 years. If we can't use it against him then we shouldn't give him credit for being there. My point that you're making for me is that it's a data point that can't be used to grade him.
"Is Kevin Sumlin being polished right now at Alabama? Is that what we're really doing?" No idea what you're talking about with the second question but yes, Sumlin went to Alabama to regain any coaching status he might be able to recover after his AZ disaster.
As far as Banks and aggy OOS 5* QB recruiting success...no clue. Aggy recruiting certainly got better from 2013-2017 but not Bama good. Let's see what he can do outside of the SEC before he's called the savior.
Pussyfooting around?? What's not obvious? I'm saying that these Alabama coaches have reaped the rewards of the Alabama machine and the legacy that Saban has created. Their results prior to Alabama were average at best on the field and disastrous off the field (except for Banks). Texas has cycled through coach after coach after coach believing that he was the fix......Strong, Herman, Diaz, Yurcich, Gilbert, Harsin, Applewhite, Searles, and on and on.... I'm going to take my time and wait for these guys to prove out before believing that we're all good to win multiple championships.
Yeah he only hit 20 homeruns that season. Later on I wondered if Al Downing served that pitch up out of respect for Aaron. The crazy thing is that if I remember right a couple of fans ran on the field and congratulated him as he ran the bases.
I am willing to take an unpopular position on Coach K. I am skeptical. Almost all of the successful d coordinators we have hired have run vanilla base formations (Robinson, Chizik, Muschamp and Ash). Almost all of the crazy schemers have flamed (Reese, Diaz, Orlando). The distinction runs deeper than base 4-2-5 or 3-3-5. Who cares if the 4th pass rusher stands up or puts his hand down if his main job is to rush the passer? All of the three failures insisted on schemes whether they were working or not. Anyone remember mugging the linebackers? Coach K may turn out great but his 2-4-5 multiple scheme is suspect in my mind.
@60rocks I respect and totally understand your reservations but there are certainly reasons to be optimistic specifically regarding Sarkisian, Flood and Banks. I've actually been trying to deep dive into the coaches for my podcast but I just wanted to share.
1.) Sark did better than an "above average' job taking an 0-11 Washington eventually to 9 wins and multiple bowl victories. That not only provides head coaching experience but an ability to build up a program. He has also developed numerous QBs including the many he had at USC and Alabama but also Jake Locker into an NFL prospect. USC won 9 games in year one and signed a top recruiting class before the drinking derailed his career. The drinking = bad but the wins and #1 recruiting class = good.
People point to Sark being fired from Atlanta but in 2018 Matt Ryan had career highs in completions, completion percentage, 2nd highest TD passes and career low in interceptions. Sure he was fired but the offense actually improved the 2nd year and if you look at that season, the defense (like it is now) was the primary issue. More on that later.
He then went to Alabama and yes they were loaded but in his second year after replacing the majority of the offensive personnel he led them to the best offense they've ever had with a QB that wasn't exactly Trevor Lawrence (no slight to Jones because I think he is really good too). Based off of his history and various circumstances, odds are if Sarkisian is coaching your QBs, he will do well with them. In the games that were closer to equal talent being on the field, Tua had 4 Td passes against LSU last year while Mac Jones had 4 TD passes against Georgia and 5 TD passes against Ohio State this past year in the national championship.
2.) On Kyle Flood, I've really had to look hard for any significant evidence of success at Rutgers. The offenses ranked really well nationally (20s) from 2005-2009 when there was talent at RB (rice) and QB (Savage) but Rutgers is just such a 'meh' team I dont know how to appropriately weigh most of their offensive statistics from 2005-2015. They are mostly in the 50-70s range outside of a couple of really bad offensive seasons. Obviously he was highly thought of to consistently receive promotions from position coach to coordinator to head coach but they really had no chance especially the big 10 of being competitive. For example, Flood's last year they went 4-8 but 6 of those losses were against Penn State, Michigan, Ohio State, Michigan State, Nebraska and Wisconsin. Rutgers never beats those teams doesn't matter who is the head coach lol. To further that point, Rutgers has won about 14 games in the last 6 years. On a positive note- Rutgers was top 10 in the country in QB sacks allowed per game in 2012, ranked 3rd in the big ten in sacks allowed and 5th in the big 10 in TFL allowed in 2014 and ranked tied for 2nd in the big 10 in TFL allowed and 9th in sacks allowed in 2015.
It is difficult to gather evidence at Atlanta too. In 2017, Atlanta had a top 10 offense in yardage and top 15 in scoring. In 2018, they had an abysmal running game but starting rb devonta freeman and both starting guards went on the IR. That offense however still remained in the top 10 yardage, specifically top 5 in passing and top 10 in scoring. Now I'm not sure how much Flood's role plays into all of that but he was once again promoted at Atlanta with more responsibilities (clock management) along with being the assistant OL coach.
Then of course we look at Alabama where Sarkisian must have also saw something in Flood who has basically been the recipient of promotions everywhere he has been. When you have coaches who succeed at a place like Alabama you really have to look hard to find examples of real impact. A couple of positive data points include- A.) Alabama had its best ever efficiency rating on third down (59.1 percent) and its highest ever efficiency rating in the red zone (90.7%). B.) His group won the Joe Moore as the best OL unit which Alabama even with all of its dominance has only won one other time. C) Starting RB Harris ended up running for more career yards than any other Alabama RB and if you look at the two seasons of Tua and Mac Jones they are the best passing numbers of any QB in Alabama history. Alabama also allowed its lowest ever amount of sacks per game in 2019 and were top 10 in TFL allowed in 2020. That is quite a few of "highest/lowest ever" and "best ever" for the Sark/ Flood combo even at a school like Alabama.
3.) Banks is considered a great recruiter by literally everyone. Seriously you could look up whoever it is that you trust on college football or any fan for that matter and they will tell you he is one of the best. He's from Texas, he builds relationships and he knows how to close. Period. Plus, His special teams expertise was not only shown at Alabama and Texas A&M but also at UTEP where he led the league in special teams statistic and at Idaho State where they led the nation in net punting twice in his three seasons.
Herman and his staff were able to get us really close in 2018 and the amount of experience and expertise on this staff is vastly superior to that one was at the time. Obviously the proof is in the pudding but the ingredients are top shelf. Hopefully that makes the burnt orange kool aid a little bit easier to drink in the meantime lol.
1.) Sark did better than an "above average' job taking an 0-11 Washington eventually to 9 wins and multiple bowl victories. That not only provides head coaching experience but an ability to build up a program. He has also developed numerous QBs including the many he had at USC and Alabama but also Jake Locker into an NFL prospect. USC won 9 games in year one and signed a top recruiting class before the drinking derailed his career. The drinking = bad but the wins and #1 recruiting class = good.
People point to Sark being fired from Atlanta but in 2018 Matt Ryan had career highs in completions, completion percentage, 2nd highest TD passes and career low in interceptions. Sure he was fired but the offense actually improved the 2nd year and if you look at that season, the defense (like it is now) was the primary issue. More on that later.
He then went to Alabama and yes they were loaded but in his second year after replacing the majority of the offensive personnel he led them to the best offense they've ever had with a QB that wasn't exactly Trevor Lawrence (no slight to Jones because I think he is really good too). Based off of his history and various circumstances, odds are if Sarkisian is coaching your QBs, he will do well with them. In the games that were closer to equal talent being on the field, Tua had 4 Td passes against LSU last year while Mac Jones had 4 TD passes against Georgia and 5 TD passes against Ohio State this past year in the national championship.
2.) On Kyle Flood, I've really had to look hard for any significant evidence of success at Rutgers. The offenses ranked really well nationally (20s) from 2005-2009 when there was talent at RB (rice) and QB (Savage) but Rutgers is just such a 'meh' team I dont know how to appropriately weigh most of their offensive statistics from 2005-2015. They are mostly in the 50-70s range outside of a couple of really bad offensive seasons. Obviously he was highly thought of to consistently receive promotions from position coach to coordinator to head coach but they really had no chance especially the big 10 of being competitive. For example, Flood's last year they went 4-8 but 6 of those losses were against Penn State, Michigan, Ohio State, Michigan State, Nebraska and Wisconsin. Rutgers never beats those teams doesn't matter who is the head coach lol. To further that point, Rutgers has won about 14 games in the last 6 years. On a positive note- Rutgers was top 10 in the country in QB sacks allowed per game in 2012, ranked 3rd in the big ten in sacks allowed and 5th in the big 10 in TFL allowed in 2014 and ranked tied for 2nd in the big 10 in TFL allowed and 9th in sacks allowed in 2015.
It is difficult to gather evidence at Atlanta too. In 2017, Atlanta had a top 10 offense in yardage and top 15 in scoring. In 2018, they had an abysmal running game but starting rb devonta freeman and both starting guards went on the IR. That offense however still remained in the top 10 yardage, specifically top 5 in passing and top 10 in scoring. Now I'm not sure how much Flood's role plays into all of that but he was once again promoted at Atlanta with more responsibilities (clock management) along with being the assistant OL coach.
Then of course we look at Alabama where Sarkisian must have also saw something in Flood who has basically been the recipient of promotions everywhere he has been. When you have coaches who succeed at a place like Alabama you really have to look hard to find examples of real impact. A couple of positive data points include- A.) Alabama had its best ever efficiency rating on third down (59.1 percent) and its highest ever efficiency rating in the red zone (90.7%). B.) His group won the Joe Moore as the best OL unit which Alabama even with all of its dominance has only won one other time. C) Starting RB Harris ended up running for more career yards than any other Alabama RB and if you look at the two seasons of Tua and Mac Jones they are the best passing numbers of any QB in Alabama history. Alabama also allowed its lowest ever amount of sacks per game in 2019 and were top 10 in TFL allowed in 2020. That is quite a few of "highest/lowest ever" and "best ever" for the Sark/ Flood combo even at a school like Alabama.
3.) Banks is considered a great recruiter by literally everyone. Seriously you could look up whoever it is that you trust on college football or any fan for that matter and they will tell you he is one of the best. He's from Texas, he builds relationships and he knows how to close. Period. Plus, His special teams expertise was not only shown at Alabama and Texas A&M but also at UTEP where he led the league in special teams statistic and at Idaho State where they led the nation in net punting twice in his three seasons.
Herman and his staff were able to get us really close in 2018 and the amount of experience and expertise on this staff is vastly superior to that one was at the time. Obviously the proof is in the pudding but the ingredients are top shelf. Hopefully that makes the burnt orange kool aid a little bit easier to drink in the meantime lol.
It's shallow thinking to gauge success at Rutgers based on conventional grading. @60rocks wants to ding Flood for things like wins over power five teams as a way of undermining what he accomplished at Rutgers without acknowledging that the program has only won nine combined games in the five years since he left and never more than 4 games in any season. He was fired for going 4-8 because of the standard that he and Greg Schiano created. From 1980-2005, Rutgers never had a single season as good as two that Flood had as a coach. If you want to say that three years after Schiano left that Flood was still piggy-backing the program he built, I'll listen to the argument, but I'm not going to let someone be dismissive of winning 8 or 9 games at a place like Rutgers when it's so historically rare in the grand scheme of things.
He hit the record tieing HR I believe on Saturday before. I watched that and it was on National TV. Both games were on network tv that had been scheduled well before in anticipation. I believe Aaron sat out the game before the Monday night game since it wasn’t televised.
GREAT stuff and well written and laid out. Thanks for researching all of that.
While I don't discount all of these coaches' past experiences, I'm also not going to discount the great benefit they receive from their time at Alabama. Flood did not get hired at Texas because of his success elsewhere, nor did SS, nor did Banks....they were hired because of their time at Alabama under Saban.
SS was 34-29 at Washington (24-21 in conference), was 1-2 in bowl games (he resigned before his 2013 bowl game) and never finished better than 3rd in a weak Pac12 conference. Had a good 2014 season at USC and then the disaster in 2015. Did he make Washington better? Yep. Would Texas have hired him had he not gone to Alabama...no.
Don't know what else to say about Flood than I've already typed in this thread. Did he make make Rutgers better while there? Yep. Would Texas have hired him had he not gone to Alabama...no.
I mentioned that I saw goodness in Banks's ability to recruit from his days at aggy. Certainly hoping that his prowess moves over with him outside of the SEC.
I've supported this team through thick and thin and haven't missed a home game or TX/ou game in the 33 years since being a freshman at Texas. I'll drink the kool aid, but I'm going to temper my expectations until these guys prove to me that their amazing recent coaching successes are not in large part directly related to being under the wing of the GOAT.
Is there a specific grade I've given to any coach that you have an issue with because I haven't seen anyone complain about even one of them?
Your argument basically gives all the Bama success to Saban because of the “juggernaut” he’s developed. That suggests that you think it’s all about the Head Coach. If so, you can’t criticize the results that any of these coaches had as assistants before being at Bama. Those issues should be laid at the foot of the head coach too, correct?
On Flood’s background, he was at Rutgers...RUTGERS. They’ve been a P5 school for a whopping SEVEN seasons. For a coach to win any P5 games there is impressive at this point.
Bottom line is you seem pissed/jilted/skeptical. I get it, but no one is saying UT wins the NC next year or even in the next 2-3 years. What’s been said is that at least the assistant coaches selected appear to be better than those selected during Strong’s and Herman’s first seasons, and that’s where it needs to start for us to truly improve.
Regarding "synergy," among coaches, I would think the offense side of the ball has it already, recruiting and playing football.
On the defense side, WOW. Lots of alpha male coaches coming together to work as a team for the first time. Might take a while for the pecking order to be established.
On the defense side, WOW. Lots of alpha male coaches coming together to work as a team for the first time. Might take a while for the pecking order to be established.
Exactly. Plus, I was more interested in how Flood did as a position coach than a head coach because there is so much more duties involved being the top guy. He’s had an incredible progression to where he his now that places the odds of being successful at Texas in his favor.
Sidenote- How would you think this staff relates to the one Sark had at USC? They obviously recruited really well and I wonder if the staff compares favorably. Sark’s background suggest that he believes you live or die on the recruiting trail and that has me really excited.
It's funny to hear you get personal by (so far) calling me ridiculous, shallow and dismissive about my opinions that I have facts for on this thread given your recent history. It also boggles my mind that you bring up Schiano as another reason to not give Flood credit (which I thought of but didn't bring up) and then immediately refute yourself......
As far as letting me be dismissive....please. If you want to skip down the street in joy about the hires, feel free. I'm going to take a more cautious approach this time because I see recency bias in these Bama hires that I HOPE work out. And if they do, I'll be happy as hell.
I think in Alabama's case, coaches have come and gone A LOT with the one consistent being Saban.
I will certainly agree with you that these coaches make me feel better than they did when Strong and Herman came in and I have hope. I will also admit to being a bit jaded given all the insane coaching turnover we've had in the last 10 years. I tend to believe that there's big value in consistency but Herman lost me completely during ISU and it was time for a change.
Recruiting big time talent is the big time solution....the teams at the top prove that every year. REALLY hoping these Bama guys can bring the recruiting wood to ATX....but again, I need to see what they can do away from the hottest school in the hottest conference without the hottest coach in the land.
